I want to address what I’m sure most of you have already seen on the internet: my profile on Grindr. For those of you who don’t know, Grindr is an app designed specifically for gay men. It shows you where the other gay guys (who also have grindr) are around you, listing them in order according to closest proximity. You can send messages, chat, etc. Most users on this app are only looking for sex; I know that because it’s what I used to use it before prior to coming to faith in Christ 3 years ago. I started fooling around on this app again a couple weekends ago. I’ve been in a pretty bad place spiritually for the past few months (really, the last year), and finally something broke in me. Weekend before last (January 26-27), I basically just let go deciding I was going to revert back to my old lifestyle…mostly because I was tired of being depressed. I felt unvalued by people and I felt like all I was doing all the time was repenting and being sad and fearful and doubtful. I remembered my life before Christ, how “free” I felt (although I really wasn’t)…. and I remembered how I could get attention, affection and acceptance from other gay guys. For a period of about 24 hours, I “tried” to just be gay again…. kind of as an escape. I know this sounds crazy, and it is crazy; but it’s really how my mind was working and processing. Although I was talking to guys on Grindr, I didn’t’ go out to the gay bars and I didn’t meet up with any guys for coffee or anything like that (much less sex), but in my heart and mind I had strayed far from God. That Sunday (the 27th), the Lord graciously opened my eyes to show me the foolishness of what I was going after. I got on the phone with my pastor (who is still in Shreveport. They are moving down next month) and I confessed to him everything that had been going on. He helped me work through some of my thoughts, etc., and just talking about it helped me clear my head. I came to Shreveport a few days later to share my testimony at a conference, and returned to New Orleans on Thursday, the 30th. On Friday, I downloaded Grindr again. I put my picture up and left it up this time…… stupidly, yes, but not blindly. I knew the risk of someone seeing me and calling me out, but I was in such a state of mind that I didn’t care. The more messages I kept getting from guys, the stronger the desire got to keep pursuing this. And by this, I mean sin. I was willingly making a choice to pursue sin and disobey God. On Saturday (the 2nd), I got an email from a guy telling me that he found me on Grindr and to “Be ready, because justice is coming.” This rattled me a bit, but not to the degree that I was “scared into” getting off of Grindr and repenting. At this point, my goal was to find someone to go out to the gay bars with. It was the superbowl and mardi gras this weekend in NOLA, and I wanted to go out. But I didn’t end up finding anyone to go out with, so I didn’t go out. Then, out of nowhere once again, I was overcome with conviction and guilt. So I talked to my pastor again, confessed, and I deleted the app. He told me to go to church in the morning (a church I’ve been visiting while I’ve been awaiting our entire church planting group to be in New Orleans). When I woke up I immediately got back on Grindr, yet somehow I still ended up in the church parking lot….. where I knew I had to make a decision. I was going to have to renounce Christ and choose sin, or I was going to have to humble myself and repent. I deleted the app (which signified a whole lot more than just deleting an app) and went into Church. My repentance doesn’t change the fact that I’ve sinned, and it doesn’t erase the temporal consequences for my sin—which I am in the midst of right now. I know most of you have read the articles, and if you haven’t, you will…. because they’re still popping up. My disobedience has impacted my life in an irreversible way. This stuff on the internet will now always be on the internet and available for all to see. And I fear the day that the Lord has words with me about how my actions have surely been a stumbling block to many. I take full responsibility for my sin, and I won’t’ attempt to blame it on any circumstance or weakness. With that said, considering what the press is printing about me, I would like to quickly address a couple of things to the gay community. Firstly, never have I ever even remotely insinuated that I am now “heterosexual” or “cured” from same sex desires. I’ve actually clearly communicated exactly the opposite. I have constantly been transparent about my present sinful desires… including the desire for homosexual interaction/behavior/attention. Some of you have come to realize this upon going and reading my blogs, and have emailed me to apologize on behalf of the things that the Huffington Post, Gawker, and other news sites have made me appear to represent. I appreciate your emails and messages, I’m sorry that I haven’t had a chance to respond to them all. I also need to say that I did not meet up with any guys I met on grindr, nor did I send any explicit photos or even remotely converse with anyone in a sexual manner. I’m not saying that I didn’t sin because I didn’t do these things. Regardless of my lack of physical sin, my heart was as sinful as it gets. I just want to be clear about exactly what happened, and what didn’t happen. I was on the app, yes. And I chatted with quite a few guys, yes. But that is it. Lastly, I would like to say to all: Despite my recent hypocritical behavior and disobedience to Christ, I stand firmly in saying that the Word of God, in totality, is true in every matter it addresses: including the sin of homosexual behavior. In all of this, the Word of Christ should not be questioned. It is not at fault, I am. Jesus is a good and loving Savior. He is gracious and forgiving to all of those who repent and ask Him for forgiveness. But sin and Jesus cannot be mingled together. I have sinned, and I believe that Christ has forgiven me because I am repenting….. but if I were to continue on in sin and refuse to repent, it would be evident that I have no part with Christ. I want to be clear as ever that a true Christian cannot embrace a lifestyle of sin—specifically here a lifestyle of homosexuality. I say this so that you all know I’m not changing my theology and disregarding what the Bible clearly says to make room for my sinful desires. Rather, I’m asking God to change my heart. And no, I don’t mean I’m asking him to change my sexual desires. I’m asking Him to change my heart—-so that whatever my desires may be, I choose Him over them. This is all I want to say at this point. I’ll be doing a more extensive interview with the Christian Post this week and will post that once it’s up. To those of you praying for me, please continue to do so. I am still not in a good place and need God to work mightily in my heart and mind. I am taking steps to get help with my depression and other issues which I think have led to my recent instability, I have a meeting with a Christian counselor next week. Pray that God would bless that, and that He’d show me what else I need to do in order to get my mind working right and my heart in full submission to Him. I don’t know that I’ve ever really been happy, or joyful, before… even though I’ve said that I have been. I’ve had spurts of happiness here and there, but it always seems to soon be drowned out by depression, sadness and fear. I’m ready to be happy……..not in sin, but in God.
Thanks for your honesty and transparency in responding to this situation, Matt. This has got to be very difficult for you. I hope that you will surround yourself with some good Christian brothers for support. Remember the work that Christ has already accomplished on your behalf, and that no matter where you find yourself, He can and will use you to bring glory to Himself. The most important thing for you is your own standing before God. Pursue him knowing that He is merciful, loving, and forgiving of His children who seek Him. As you said, their may be long lasting worldly consequences because of this, but more important than that, there is immediate forgiveness for you through your repentance. Although people may remember this – because of Christ’s righteousness extended to you, through His forgiveness He will see it no more. You don’t have to be perfect Matt, none of us are. 1 John 1:8
Take care of yourself and don’t let this deter you from being useful to Him and from enjoying the perfect love that He offers to you.
Is that the same perfect love your god had for his children when it attacked this planet and murder every child, mother (pregnant or not it did not seam to matter), father, grandparent, old and infirm person, by drowning them, oh wait he did let a guy named noah his family, and some animals. Amen brother lets all pray to the Mass murderer you call god.
“Don’t be a dick.”
When Giod kills people, it is not murder.
Actually if you read the Bible carefully you would realise that God told Noah to warn the people that He would send a flood to wipe out the earth but NO ONE listened to Noah so they ended up dying, it was all their fault. God gave them the opportunity to live but they refused it. The same way God is giving you the opportunity to live but you seem to be refusing it! Accept Jesus, He is the only way to real life!
So did god warn the parents of Newtown that their children were going to be slaughtered…and they just ignored his warning? That’s what some of your christianist friends are saying. That because President Obama “loves the gays” that the poor, young, innocent children and their teachers at Newtown had to die. What a kind and loving, merciful father you have. I can see why you’re all so desperate to leave this mortal coil and join him in heaven.
None of my “christianist friends” are saying that. I’m not sure what you mean by “christianist,” but not everyone who calls him or herself a Christian is one, and even you can discern between what is appropriate and what is not. It’s not correct to say that the Sandy Hook victims were being judged by God for Obama’s attitude toward homosexuality. They were killed as a result of the sin of one man, the shooter, and God has a plan to eradicate sin for good.
Ok, you can dance around it as long as you want, just don’t bad mouth gay people. You can not pray the gay away. You are either gay or you are not. While I can understand your conflict, as you have not accepted yourself, I would appreciate it if you would not preach this ex-gay shit, since it causes other young gays to feel like it is a disease they can beat. And when they can’t, they kill themselves. You, on the other hand, seem to give yourself a God-pass every time you “slip up.” All I am asking is that you fix your own house, and stop preaching bullshit that you know is not true, so that others will not suffer from your self-righteous and sanctimonious bullshit.
Amen Rocky! Praise jeebus!!
are you a Christian? if so you need to repent for your vulgarity. And get off Matt’s back. It’s a LIE fro hell taht ppl can’t change, many have, that is a fact. So, YOU leave him alone.
Are YOU a christian my friend? Judging from your words and animus toward others you’re one of those so-called christians who likes to sow discord which, according to Prov 6:19, makes you an ABOMINATION. Prov 16:5 probably pertains to you as well. Not Ezek 18:6 (“… or approach a woman during her menstrual period”) because you’re obvs one of those “ex-gays” who’s desperately clinging to the notion that you’ve “left the homosexual lifestyle.” Whatever that it…
no I’m none of what you think. And neither am I sowing discord. you are though. and why quote the Bible since you don’t follow or respect it’s teachings anyway?
It’s actually not a lie that there is no evidence of people changing – there have been nothing showing that people change from an exclusively homosexual orientation (being attracted to the same sex), and losing that and replacing it with a different heterosexual orientation (being attracted to the opposite sex).
Many have gone back into the closet, or decided to live as if they were heterosexual, though. Matt, for instance, admit’s he hasn’t changed – just as the leaders of the ex-gay movement admit they don’t promise change, that about 99.9% of the people they work with just learn to suppress their orientation and deal with it, not change.
So I tell you flat out that I know ppl and then you keep telling me its a lie. You’re the perfect example of how the LGBT movement is censuring and suppressing the truth on this issue because it pokes a hole in their agenda.
I could say that I know people who believe they’re aliens. Or that I know people who think they’re Jesus. Does that make it true? No.
If John Smid and Exodus both now admit that “ex-gay” is not real, why should I believe your hearsay? Are YOU one of these alleged “ex-gay” types?
You may misunderstand: I believe you know people, I do not believe you know people who have changed from an exclusive homosexual orientation to a heterosexual orientation. You would have no way of knowing this, obviously, for one – you would be relying only on their personal testimony. And secondly such a personal testimony people have often lied about, lied about being cured while still having same sex attractions.
I have no need to censure you or suppress the truth. I know of course there is no way now for these people to retroactively PROVE that they had a homosexual orientation, and now to prove that they have a heterosexual orientation only, but perhaps people going into ex-gay therapy would submit themselves to study – that would be a wonderful way to eliminate personal testimony from people’s claims, and we could just focus on the facts!
A GodPass?! Thank you, that is the best phrase I have come across to describe something that I have always found amusing.
There are gay-friendly churches that can be found by googling that phrase. They are exactly that preaching the gospel of love and acceptance that has been provided in the NEW covenant. “Why do you see the speck that is in your brother’s eye, but do not notice the log that is in your own eye?” Matthew 7:3. It’s not for us to judge one another. Before we can help one another we must first address our “the log in our own eye”
I only heard about your problems in the news and my heart goes out to you. You’re in a cult. It’s a socially accepted cult, but it’s still a cult. Their teachings are oppressive and harmful. It is the same cult which gave the West the Crusades, the Inquisition and the Dark Ages when it was at the height of its power. Now its dogma is having its way with you. It is doing you much more harm than any homosexual act ever could. Just look at the evidence around you. You’re cult demands you perform this self effacing nonsense. You must make a public confession of your “sins” – while your cult actively seeks to legal equality and denies people even the most basic dignities. They are the sinners, sir. All you did was have some fun. They are ruining our culture. Dumbing us down with their repressive cult edicts and anti-education, anti-science, anti-civilization agenda. The only thing you are doing wrong is letting them exploit you to ruin other people. Quit being a Christian tool. They do not care about you. They think you are a pervert. They think you are scum. Let them all go.
@liz “Many, many days I have failed to fight perfectly. I have at many times in my walk stooped down and willingly spoon-fed myself the familiar, vile vomit that is sin.” – Matt Moore
What makes you think his cult’s teachings are “oppressive and harmful?” Doesn’t that sound like someone who’s happy and well-adjusted? You don’t think so? Me neither. He needs help. Real help. I hope he gets it.
Everyone struggles man. I would encourage you to read Torn by Justin Lee. Don’t just scluff it off, but give it a real open-minded read.
Self-loathing is a slow form of suicide. Poor Matt.
How about poor Jadin Bell?
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/02/04/jadin-bell-dead-gay-oregon-teen-hanging_n_2617909.html
This kid killed himself because he was bullied at school. Fools like Matt Moore who have been seduced by the false promises of virulently homophobic “ex-gay” ministries only aid in the destruction of GAY CHILDREN.
It is time to stop feeling sorry for this guy and to start holding him accountable. He lies to himself, he lies to everyone, and in doing so he helps to further the hateful, destructive, homophobic “ex-gay” cause. Yes, it is tragic that he cannot overcome self-loathing. But he is an adult, and as an adult he needs to recognize the fact that his actions have consequences. When you help to spread homophobia, you have the blood of dead gay children on your hands. That is the reality, and that needs to be the message we focus on spreading. Gay kids are KILLING THEMSELVES, people.
And it is entirely their fault.
It’s ultimately their fault for killing themselves, but it’s not entirely their fault for feeling that the only way to escape from the pressures they feel is suicide. We should all feel sympathy for those who kill themselves, and be a hand of support, not condemnation.
I post about gay children killing themselves after being ceaselessly tormented by homophobic bullies, and in no time we have two people claiming that it’s “their fault.” Wrong. These kids would not be committing suicide if not for the fact that homophobes harass and bully them to the point that they feel like there is no hope.
I said it before, and I will say it again–if you tell me I am worthy of death long enough, I will willingly participate in my own destruction. If you tell me that I am dirty, sinful, disgusting, and going to hell because of the way I was born–the way I love–I will kill myself on your behalf. If you endlessly abuse a gay child for his or her natural, unchangeable orientation, then he or she will obviously feel that there is no light at the end of the tunnel.
Straight Christians Americans (usually white, although this hatred certainly crosses racial lines) have no concept of the persecution gay kids in America go through. You live lives of unprecedented privilege, and you claim to be Christlike while simultaneously behaving in a hideously destructive fashion. Wake up to the fact that your actions have consequences.
Although as for “SHOES THROWER”–I’m pretty sure you’re just trolling. I would prefer to believe that you’re a troll, because otherwise I have to believe that anyone could be that stupid.
It does not change the fact that same-sex buggery is sin.
What is gay?
Does it mean one has attractions or that they choose to act them out?
Some people believe that, I don’t. And you’re free to believe that opinion, not fact.
Someone who is gay is a person whose romantic and sexual attractions are directed at others of the same sex. Someone who is straight is a person whose romantic and sexual attractions are directed at others of the opposite sex.
One does not have to act on attractions to be gay, or straight. Straight and gay people can be virgins, they can be celibate, and they can be single, and some straight and gay people choose to be.
Matt thank you for your honesty! I will continue to pray for you!
Matt,
I’m praying for you, you can count on that. My prayer is that you will find love, first love for yourself, and then, the love God created you to give to another person to whom you are attracted.
You have conflated your past self-destructiveness with your sexual orientation. They aren’t the same. A good licensed psychotherapist with a Master’s or a Ph. D. in social work and/or clinical psychology can help you to understand that and to cope with the deep pain that you are experiencing. There are healthy ways of being and unhealthy ways of being. Sexual orientation has nothing to do with either.
You don’t need nouthetic or “Christian” counseling to help you figure out how to repress who you are. You need someone to help you find authenticity. If your authenticity is to live celibate, so be it. If your authenticity is to live in a heterosexual marriage, so be it…. and if your authenticity is to live in a wonderful loving relationship with another man, so be it. But you need to arrive at that determination honestly after learning to love yourself the way you are… the way JESUS loves you. If you continue repressing your natural inclination, you are headed to a far greater implosion than you have already experienced.
How do I know? Well, as I’ve told you before, when I was your age I said exactly the same things, did exactly the same things you are doing. Then I fell in love with another beautiful man. Love is what Christians are called to do. Jesus said “Love one another as I have loved you. By this shall all men know that you are my disciples: if you have love for one another.” And I John says “Love is of God and anyone who loves is born of God and knows God, for God is love.”
My friend, I don’t think you love yourself very much, and that pains me… because I know what that feels like, too. I pray for you. I weep for you. And I’m here to talk when you’re ready. You don’t have to agree with me, and I’m willing to just listen, but please, please Matt, hear me: you don’t have to live like this.
Jesus loves you and He wants you to be happy.
And, Matt, so do I.
Jeffrey Hoffman
Executive Director
BJUnity
the affirming alternative for LGBT+ alumni and students of Bob Jones University
Where in the Bible does it say to be happy by pursuing un-natural sexual attractions? In sin we were conceived, and into sin we are born. That doesn’t change from the cradle to the grave, but when you accept Christ, you turn away from self. Your advice is not biblical, and actually could lead to severe UNhappiness. Just like I have to choose every day not to sin, Matt has to choose not to sin, i.e., homosexuality. I am sorry you are so misled about what Christ wants for your life. Our happiness should be to explore who GOD is by enjoying HIM forever. We are not to be fulfilled by another human. For me to live is Christ…my husband (though amazing, and I’m very much in love with him) is not where I get my identity. My identity is in Christ, and Christ alone. If I see my identity as tied to my sexuality then I have bought into a lie from the devil.
The same place it says to be happy by pursuing natural sexual attractions. Oh, right. You don’t get happiness by pursuing sexual attractions, nor did anyone say that.
Advice like his has led many to happiness – just as biblical advice can lead to unhappiness. And the opposite of both is true.
But we who understand Christ wants love and happiness for us are not misled.
We are not fulfilled by another human, you have to love yourself first. People do not get their identity from their spouses, they come from who they are.
You are so naive I actually feel bad for you. Normally, I would lecture you on how stupid and ignorant you are, but now all I feel is pity. Pity that you will never experience how great life can be once you start thinking for yourself, and stop blindly someone’s (incorrect) interpretation of what the bible means, and how you should act.
Then why is Matt so freaking unhappy? All these posts of “conversion” and “rescue from sin”, etc., and now he admits he’s been despressed and unhappy. Pursuing “Jesus” gave him nothing!
Pure, unadulterated B S. Your commentary is both inane and irrelevant. you can wallow in your own misguided beliefs but leave others to sort out their own life. You are welcome to your own opinions but NOT your own facts…
Bryan,
buggery is a sin.
@Jennifer. What may be ‘un-natural sexual attractions’ to you are natural for someone who is gay. I wish people would stop judging and condemning other people. Judgment and condemnation is God’s responsibility not ours.
Correct. My same-sex attraction is perfectly natural to me. When boys in grade 6 all of a sudden thought girls were cute I was like: what?!?! I tried and tried for it to be my reality…never happened.
All of the condemnation has got to stop.
Jennifer, I’m so sad you were deprived of a sentimental education. I can’t imagine how it must be like having no sympathy for others…
It’s funny how the very same people who point out that homosexuality is a “sin” are judging their fellow man. The bible says that doing judging others is a sin too.
And using your own narrow-minded standards, to pass judgment on people whom you don’t know nor will ever affect your life is not only a sin in and of itself. But what’s worse, all of you judgmental people are wasting emotion and energy on people you will never meet. Good look with that madness.
Jeffrey Hoffman – Matt, this guy’s post contained ZERO Biblical truth. Mr Hoffman is as confused as they come and he does not worship the same God you and I do of the Holy Scriptures. His God and idol is his sin of homosexuality and will do whatever it takes to suppress truth as defined in Romans 1. It’s too bad you have to sift through all this garbage in your moment of need but I know you know the truth so hang in there. He that is within us is by far much stronger than the spirit of deception in these posts. God bless you brother. If you need anything feel free to call.
So those quotes were lies, the ones from John and Jesus?
He does not seem confused at all to me, and definitely seem like he worships God of love pointed out in the Bible.
He did not seem to mention any God of sin, or a God of homosexuality. Nor did he seem to mention Romans 1 at all, or how it mentions people worshipping idols and turning over to all sorts of lust and sin right there.
I understand you need to call support garbage that conflicts with your view, but you don’t need to lie about it and attack other people as confused. When you attack other people, you show that it’s not Christ that is speaking through you at that point.
Dear Doug et al,
I quoted John’s gospel, Chapter 13, verses 34 and 35, which most of Christendom understands as the Mandatum, or “new commandment” of Jesus. This new commandment defines an ethic by which all Christians are required to live. I likewise quoted I John 4: 7-13 which tells us in very plain language that love comes from God.
If we read further in that same passage in I John, we find that if anyone confesses that Jesus Christ is the Son of God abides in Him. So, for those who have called my Christianity into question or who have called me “confused” (I am not, but Matt is, and you are the ones confusing him), I assert this simple statement from Scripture as evidence that my faith is real and my claim to the title of Christian is as valid as anyone else’s who has been redeemed by the Lamb of God who takes away the sins of the whole world. (John 1: 29, just so you know those are words from Scripture, too).
When it comes to Matt’s (and my) natural sexual attraction to members of the same sex, Jesus never said one word of condemnation. If you want to read condemnation for gay people in Romans 1, you are actually reading the text upside down. If you accept that this passage is talking about all forms of expressing homosexual orientation (I and many, many biblical scholars do not) and you follow the logic of the apostle carefully, you would realize that this is the effect, not the cause of idolatry. Since I am not an idolator — despite your claims to the contrary, I actually work in Christian ministry and I have devoted my life to Jesus Christ — I am confident that Romans 1 is not talking about me. There has been much written on this passage from an hermeneutical and ancient language etymological perspective by CONSERVATIVE theologians that disagrees with the way most evangelicals and fundamentalists bash gay people with it.
Matt, you’re unhappy because you apparently have impulse control issues and perhaps because you are lonely. Your testimony and even this latest incident on GRINDR (not the best place to meet the love of your life, by the way, but I digress) speaks to this issue of impulse control. That is not about your sexuality or your sexual orientation. It is about your need to fill a void in your life, a deep pain that hurts unbearably at times. This is the kind of pain that left untreated results in drug addiction and other forms of self-destructive behavior. I’m not a psychotherapist, so I can’t offer you that kind of help or I would. But you really, really need to see a qualified psychotherapist who will help you work through those things. No qualified therapist is ever going to ask you to stop believing in Jesus or to go against your convictions — that would be unethical, in fact, my Jewish therapist here in New York City helped me to become a better Christian than I had ever been by separating my potential for empathy and compassion from the guilt that fundamentalism instilled — but they might show you how to love yourself and to believe in yourself. And before someone says that self love isn’t Biblical, let’s be clear that Jesus said that we should “love your neighbor as you love yourself.” So, if you want to twist that passage to read that you don’t need to love yourself first, then that lets you off the hook for the other half of it, too. But that is clearly not what Jesus intended. Jesus talks constantly in the gospels about LOVE.
And for those who want to throw around the three Greek words that are translated as love in the New Testament, I ask you, do you really think that somebody who grew up in Biblical fundamentalism isn’t aware of those distinctions and the constant harping the purity police make on the distinction between eros and agape, in particular? The problem is that you people are preaching a dualism that isn’t Christianity. It’s Gnostic. It is not humanly possible to separate those three kinds of love in a healthy relationship with a chosen spouse for heterosexual people any more than it is for homosexual or bisexual people. God is the author of all three, and Jesus taught us a love ethic so we would know the healthiest place for us to focus our erotic energy is in the context of a loving relationship.
The proof that gay people are quite capable of forming meaningful relationships that last a lifetime is quite simply that there are many, many, many who have and who do. And, Matt, if that is what your heart wants for you, you can have it too.
So, no, I’m not confused. I’m honest. I’ve lived this pain. I know where it leads. I want nothing more than to spare you the consequences of religiously-motivated repression that Jesus did not intend for you to have. Let me return to I John 4: 18 for a moment. “There is no fear in love, because perfect love casts out fear.” Matt, your fear and those who would control you with it are not of God. God is love.
Peace,
Jeffrey Hoffman
Executive Director
BJUnity
except your dishonest Jeffrey. You can disagree with what Scripture says but to say it condones homosexuality is a lie, and that Jesus never spoke of such matter. It’s lie. And I think you know it. It’s also a lie that only fundamentalists read it as such. It is only now very lately that some try to twist and deny what is said about this matter because it is not PC, but it is utterly dishonest. So lets get honest shall we?
Jesus commanded us to avoid same-sex buggery.
I am shocked by the lack of understanding of the Bible and its contents here (and the poor grammar and spelling!) If you’re going to condemn something, at least understand what you’re reading. Nothing makes me sadder than someone who says he’s following Christ and then doesn’t have the first clue as to what he’s reading. Please cite a verse where Jesus condemns homosexuality. You can’t — first because there are no verses and secondly, ancient Greek didn’t even have a word for homosexual. Jesus did speak of hypocrisy and divorce. Paul spoke of certain same-sex acts that should be avoided, but he also recommended that all men stay single and celibate — and that women should not instruct men in the Bible. So if you’re a woman on here — you’re sinning. Go sit down.
This was by far the worst post of all. To so blatanly LIE about what Scripture says, and what Jesus said and claim you are “shocked” ??? Rom 1:26-27, Lev 18:22, Mt 5:27-32, 19:3-9, 15:19 (porneia = sexual immorality, among them included is homosexuality), Gen 2:24. These are some main places. And look up Josephus “Against Apion” 2:215 and Antiquities of the Jews 1:194 too. Your post nothing short of absurd.
Jeffery,
Your statements are very similar to the message was convey to me by a gay friend justifying his gay choices. He also suggested to me that heterosexual men who struggle with attraction to porn should just embrace it and accept it as normal and healthy lifestyle. You are way off point and seem to ignore the epidemic rates of STDs in the gay community tragically many lives of many young men and it seems that everyday I read about a well-known gay killing themselves due to the unsolved pain in their lives despite their acceptance of their lifestyle. I have lived with such individuals and it seems unsolved issues tend to drive these men to find comfort in the gay lifestyle instead of authenticate male relationships where it is tainted by sexual immortality.
Wow, your gay friend perhaps could use some help. Gay doesn’t mean promiscuous, and addiction is not normal or healthy. Addictions that get in the way of how you function in your daily life are not good – no matter gay or straight.
There are epidemic rates of STDs among those who are promiscuous, and definitely I wouldn’t be encouraging anyone to have promiscuous, risky, or careless sex! That’s not moral, or safe!
It seems I read a lot more about gay youth who struggle with bullying and acceptance killing themselves rather than well-known gays. There have been studies that in general, accepting your sexual orientation does lead to homosexuals being happier!
It seems what you are actually saying is that unsolved issues drive men to find comfort in sex – I don’t think people gay or straight should seek that. People should all seek to have authentic relationships with male and female friends, and find someone to love whatever gender that may be.
“gay friend justifying his gay choices”
Practicing religion is a choice. No one chooses to be gay.
If you tell me that I am worthy of death long enough, I will willingly participate in my own destruction. If you call me names, tell me I’m unnatural, and convince me that the way I love is a sin, I will pull the trigger for you. As a heterosexual, most likely white, “Christian” American male (male, right?), you live your life with an enormous amount of privilege. You cannot possibly imagine what it is like to grow up in a society in which the message that you are less-than, not good enough, disgusting, an aberration, and that you are going to burn in hell for all eternity, is constantly reinforced. Gay kids aren’t killing themselves “because they’re gay.” They’re killing themselves because they are tortured by the moronic offspring of intolerant cretins, and the adults who are supposed to be protecting them DO NOTHING. Until Christians stop blaming homosexuality for gay peoples’ suicides, it will remain blatantly obvious to rational people that you are not very Christlike at all.
So gay men can find love with another man, just as long as they avoid buggery?
That sounds simple in theory, but a same-sex relationship is a great source of temptation to commit buggery. It would take a lot of grace to be in an emotionally intimate relationship with someone of the same sex while avoiding buggery.
People can find love with other people. Whether you are male or female, whether your partner is male or female, you can find love. But you have to be seeking love, not seeking sex.
You can also love your partner and have sex with them – you don’t have to avoid sex completely to remain in love and find love, no.
All relationships are a great source of temptation to have sex. It does take a lot of grace to be emotionally intimate with someone and abstain, if that is what people decide to do.
If someone you love is of the same sex, avoiding sex with them is mandated by the Lord God JEHOVAH.
Some people believe that. I don’t.
You’re free to believe that, and believe that God mandated that. I don’t. And many don’t.
And only through one’s own relationship with God can they decide that.
People choose to commit same-sex buggery.
Just say no to same-sex buggery- as Matt ultimately did
People choose to commit sex acts. People choose to commit opposite-sex sex acts, and people choose to commit same-sex sex acts.
No one chooses to be gay or straight.
Matt is free to choose to accept that he is gay, and to choose to abstain from sex, just like anyone regardless of their orientation could choose to abstain.
Jeffrey Hoffman, Your words are sugar-sweet and temptation itself. You take Jesus’ words but you do not understand them.
When he says, “Love one another as I have loved you”, he is not talking about romantic love (eros) he is talking about sacrificial love (agape). When he says “Love is of God”, he is saying that God is the author of love (Real ultimate authentic agape love which is what God Is). This doesn’t mean man’s version of love. Whether we have the brokenness of straight or gay sexuality (and everyone has to some extent), we are called to discover what God means by love and we know He is ultimately talking agape not eros. God also created eros and it is a driver towards Christian marriage, but it comes and goes and does not last without Christ’s agape in the mix, so this brings it’s own challenges. Agape has to flourish for a marriage to flourish. Where people take their broken heterosexual sexuality into the marriage relationship, they will struggle to remain married and that is sin, just as much as straight or gay lusts. All non-marriage relationships should be agape and philemon.
I sometimes wonder if people with a gay view-point have an idealized view of marriage. When a man and woman come together the eros is usually wonderful, a present from God. But in order to maintain the marriage relationship, you have to die to yourself and move to agape love. Pregnancy and child-birth usually strain the relationship, it is not pretty as celebs would like us to believe. Wealth can help make it seem easy, but an average couple know the truth. The sleep deprivation that comes with a newborn removes any traces of fantasy. A woman’s body goes through unspeakable things and if she breastfeeds, well that is a whole new world of pain… These are things that gay men never have to face together like a young married couple do, they never have to upset the balance of their partnership with this new uncontrolled injection of physical, mental, emotional chaos. It is part of what established agape in a marriage. That is just one aspect of how God shapes us and for all those who do not marry for whatever reason, God has other paths that will shape them. They are no better, no worse. There is more freedom for those who do not marry, perhaps more a problem of long-term loneliness, but many people are married on the outside and lonely within, the busyness of their responsibilities keeping them distracted. The challenge for the church is to promote/support relationships to nourish everyone married or not. The challenge for those who cannot/do not want to marry is to make those communities/structures/relationships work so that people aren’t lonely, so that they find intimacy with God on a daily basis, rather than take the world’s most palatable solution (same-sex monogamy) and try to superimpose it on God.
good comment.
A woman’s body goes through “unspeakable things”? Wow, you sound like a fantastic potential mate. Not all straight couples choose to have children. Are they living in sin? I hear a lot of religious folk, upon having Leviticus called into question, hastily refer to Paul. But Paul seems like he hated sex in general, thought it was all filthy and short of the glory of asceticism. Not all of us believe in the Christian nonsense about our bodies being dirty and sinful–why should atheists have to be subjected to your intolerance? Seriously, why do we have to put up with “Christian” morality in public life? You’re always telling gay people to get back in the closet. How about you practice what you preach and stop rubbing your Christianity in my face–keep it in your house and in your church, ya know, behind closed doors. It’s gross.
Silver, for how long have you been practicing Gnosticism?
“My son, pay attention to my wisdom, turn your ear to my words of insight, that you may maintain discretion and your lips may preserve knowledge. For the lips of the adulterous woman drip honey, and her speech is smoother than oil; but in the end she is bitter as gall, sharp as a double-edged sword. Her feet go down to death; her steps lead straight to the grave. She gives no thought to the way of life; her paths wander aimlessly, but she does not know it.” -Proverbs 5: 1-6
Jeffrey – I’m very moved by your compassionate and wise words in this environment which is not just hostile to your message, but seems incapable of receiving and weighing your words with intellectual rigor. I’m very impressed with your devotion to your faith and your humanity.
Matt – you clearly say you are depressed, and you are acting in ways that are contrary to your happiness and well being. Please, please, please follow Jeffery’s advice and seek professional help from a “licensed psychotherapist with a Master’s or a PhD. in social work and/or clinical psychology” who can help you. You do not need to cease being a Christian or lead a sinful life to undergo therapy. You can continue to be a member of your church. You may be able to choose celibacy. But you need to see a therapist.
I’m somewhat of an outsider here. I’m a gay Jew who found lasting love with another man (36+ monogamous years now) (and he’s not Jewish!) (Oy vey!) and, if I can be serious, had my own battle with being gay and my religious and social values. It took me many years – and therapy – to accept my sexuality.
Shoes Thrower (or “saboteur” in French) – You sure are fixated on “buggery”, or anal sex. You sound like an Elizabethan legal document. I concur that the sin specified in Leviticus SPECIFICALLY refers to anal sex between two males and the majority of Conservative and Reform Jewish scholars now support that opinion. Some Orthodox scholars do as well. The beautiful language of the KJV has, in some cases been superseded by 400 years of scholarly advancements in translating ancient languages. Anyway, I don’t have anal sex. Period. No matter what you think, two males who wish to be intimate are not compelled to have anal sex.
Besides, what are you doing in Leviticus? You who accept Jesus as the Christ are living under grace. No? (Oh, i know you’ll say “I’m not in Leviticus, I’m in the NT.” But, frankly, I don’t believe you.)
Dave in Snowy Boston – I’m from snowy Toronto, Ontario (Canada) but, thankfully, am in Puerto Vallarta, Mexico right now. Your words of kindness and wisdom speak volumes. It’s too bad that your message most likely won’t get through to him. He’s surrounded himself with people who, like “Shoes Thrower” as always focusing on the “sex act” of a gay relationship and not on the love, caring, understanding and mutuality. I’ve been with my guy for almost 24 years, but you’ve got us beat. Mazel Tov!
As I read some of the comments here it makes me think: no wonder Matt’s in such a state!! I used to feel anger when I read his writings, mostly because I feel that his words will do a great amount of damage to many. People like him who are looking for support, only to be told that the only way to happiness means leaving the “homosexual lifestyle.” He equates that with his past drinking, partying and casual sex but that can be either orientation, gay or straight. I’m gay, and I have lots of gay friends, and that was never part of ours lives. We didn’t have to “leave” that “lifestyle” because we never lived it. We were too busy going to school and working part-time jobs to pay the bills.
I could go on and on but I’ve got work to do. Take care my friend!
@ ostracario – Buenas Dias! (and the same to everyone on this blog): You are in Puerto Vallarta ??? I’m sure Toronto is a bit chilly. but we who are living in the Boston area are not having a picnic this weekend, although it’s not as bad as forecasted.
@Dave in Snowy Boston
In PV, yes, I fly home tomorrow. Not sure how much snow they got in TO yesterday but judging from the texts and pics I was sent, it was not a fun day. Hopefully all the snow will be shoveled by the time we get back.
Btw, I would love to see Boston some day. We’re visiting friends in Delaware this summer. I wonder how close it is. I’ll take a look…
Enjoy your weekend!
Justin Lee believes that it is okay to have same sex relationships.
As long as it does not include buggery, right?
Shoo, troll.
Shoes Thrower – After reading more of this blog I’m beginning to understand that you really are just trolling, and in the most immoral and disgusting way imaginable.
I’m so naive that I take people – especially in a religious discussion – at face value. You, however, just sit back and lob spit balls of “buggery” and other demented c**p at will. You don’t care what destruction you cause, do you? Having fun? Go away NOW.
I was informing Matt about Justin Lee because someone recommended his book to him. I wanted matt to know in case he decides to read it.
Dear Matt,
Here’s an “alternative lifestyle” that might give you peace. To embrace it, you must leave behind any church that leads you to believe that you are somehow “perverted” and that you embody a special, particularly repulsive category of sin. Since you believe that healing resides in a relationship with God, consider that God’s healing for you may not be in making you “normal”, but in freeing you of the oppression of the judgement rendered by others and yourself.
There are many Christian fellowships in which GLTB persons find not only refuge, but welcome. In these places, Christians read the whole Bible, not just a few notorious verses taken out of context and misrepresented as to intent. (Check out the book “Is The Homosexual My Neighbor?”) Based on the Bible’s overarching theme of God’s unfathomable love for Creation and all that is in it, these Christians work to realize God’s vision of a world in which all are reconciled and all divisions cease. If you have a servant’s heart and the gift of leadership, you would not be barred from various ministries by some litmus test of sexual orientation. Rather, you would be assessed on character and skill, and the depth of your spiritual life. Come out of the anti-gay churches with their toxic theology and patronizing disciplines and shake the dust from your feet.
This post is as unBiblical as you could get and there isn’t any truth in it. It is a perversion of Romans 1 and 1st Corinthians 6.
Doug, do you have that response on autoreply or something? Nobody cares. It just exposes you as a bigoted fundamentalist nitwit. Christians made it through 2000 years without your judgmental nonsense and they’ll be around long after you’re gone. Matt has a problem, and you’re part of it.
You miss the point. Sin leads to bondage and death. Jesus Christ came to set us free from sin and its bondage; not to condone it or to leave us wallowing in it or to leave us enslaved to it. True freedom is in Christ. The thought-life battle is only won by renewing our minds through God’s Holy Word.
Right… Nobody should feel enslaved by their sin, or their sexual orientation. They should feel free in love. Love does not lead to bondage or death. Jesus came to set us free from sin, not love.
Here is one example.
Hey, great post my brother. I follow you on twitter and Facebook but since there’s only so much one can say in 140 characters or a FB post, I thought I’d write you an email.
As far as I can see, you’re in no different place than the rest of us who struggle with SSA. I can appreciate your struggles even more because I am, in a lot of ways, sharing them now. I may not download apps or turn on porn, but after being our and sexually active with guys from the ages of 18-39, I really don’t need them. I have the memories, like them or not. I have no idea what the end of this journey will be, but I know the goal should be holiness and not heterosexuality.
I really wanted to address the guilt you may be carrying because of your walk and readership. Bro, let it go. For real, let it go. None if us ought to be looking to you; we should be looking to Jesus! And the reality is that while your actions may have raised questions in my mind, I made whatever choices I’ve made, not you. Nothing you did forced me to do anything I may have chosen to do. Yes, your blog posts are inspiring and helpful, but at the end of the day if I’m not reading The Word when I need spiritual guidance, that’s on me, not you.
I got nothing but love for ya, Matt. I’m gonna keep praying over you and will probably keep going after that spirit of rejection I messages you about on Facebook; I think now more than ever you need to take a look in that direction. But you know that already.
Blessings to you. If you have a chance to reply, super, but I know you’re probably swamped with emails to respond to at this point.
David
Sent from my iPhone
Praise The Lord for your comment . Matt is my hero.
Matt you are greatly loved. I will pray for you God Bless.
I’ll pray for you! It takes courage to own up to your mistakes. God Bless!
Amen brother! Keep fighting the good fight!
I completely know where you are coming from. I too was on there this past week. Off now. Would apperciate prayer
So thankful for your transparency. God continues to use us despite us. You are going to beat this.
There is a book you should read.. Openly Gay, Openly Christian.
That’s an oxymoron.
No, it’s not.
Some may believe you can’t accept your sexual orientation and have a relationship with Christ. I don’t. Many can, and do.
A better selection for reading material would be ” A Strong Delusion” by Joe Dallas.
Actually, JESUS ACTED UP by Robert Goss would be worth a read.
Matt … thanks so much for your transparency. Know I will be praying for you, and will continue to be a brother in Christ standing behind as support.
I, too, deal with depression on a daily basis. If you would ever like to chat, here’s my email: 611ministries at gmail dot com.
Matt – Friend. Beloved of God. Dearly loved. Chosen. Called. Brought out of darkness into this marvelous light. Royal. Priesthood. Holy. Belonging to God. Brother. Prince. Honored. Appointed. Pure. Spotless. Cleansed. Lifted up. IT IS OKAY. I know you think it is the end of the world right now and you are scrambling to do damage control. Just let them say what they will. Let God fight this battle. This is about what JESUS is doing in Matt, not about what Matt is doing in Matt. Is this the end of you? Is this the end of Christianity? Is this the end of God’s ability to work in you? Is this the end of your story? Why do you think God can’t use this? Why do you think this will not be useful to those who are Christians and on Grindr? You happen to be more public than those who are hiding on Grindr. So you are showing them the difference and how to handle it when they stumble too. Some have already thrown in the towel and said, “I can’t control this and I’m sick of fighting it so I’m going to give in and find a way to reconcile the fact that I have these powerful desires for gay men (or women) and the fact that I know God is for real.” This battle belongs to the Lord. Hide yourself in Him. He does not condemn you and neither do I. More self-condemnation will not make it easier to fight this battle. Keep being honest and keep coming into the light. It is one of our greatest weapons. I love you. You are going to make this. Tami
________________________________
Right on!
We all struggle with something Mat, don’t be too hard on yourself. I will be praying for you as you battle depression and thank you for being honest and to be willing to share with others about this. It takes a lot of courage to do it. Don’t let the media get you down, seek for God’s face and keep His word on your heart. Know exactly who you are in Christ!
Praying for you. We all fall short, daily. Thank God for His grace.
Dude you’re GAY. You were on Grindr because u were horny and looking for dick. Accept it! I think you need some serious help.
Hey, look at it this way, you’re young, good looking, in New Orleans, during Mardi Gras, how could you not resist? But you did. Well don’t struggle with your desires, the devil won’t let you go easy, just observe them and ignore them, God knows your heart and will give you the strength to resist them. Temptation is a good thing, gives us the opportunity to become strong in our walk, he who endures to the end………………..
Matt, transparency is one of your best gifts. So many of us struggle in private and never feel a need to announce to the world any shortcomings, much less outright sin in our life. Just because you are posting publically doesn’t mean there aren’t countless others going through the exact same process, privately. There should be no difference from anyone’s perspective of this other than to realize this IS part of the process, NOT a failure to follow it. We are instructed to strive unto perfection, however, there has only been one who was able to do it. Jesus will always be the example and no matter what happens, keep working on it as I am confident you will. All of your feelings are also my feelings, my failings, my sorrows, my pain, my depression, all of these cycling back to repentence, and God is always faithful to forgive no matter how long it takes. Ultimately finding the peace that passes all understanding…
Amen! Transparency is absolutely necessary if we want to bring glory to God. Look at 2 Corinthians 12.
Amen! Matt’s on the road to recovery. Now he just need to find a nice Christian boy, settle down, and try to shake off the demons of his “ex-gay” past.
Matt: stand firm in the faith. God is love, but all love is not of God so continue to focus on truth of the Bible. Don’t let some of these sway your thoughts because the deception they espouse will be judged.
What gets me is that these “gay Christians” don’t just disagree with a traditional view, they want everyone to embrace their view. If they don’t want to follow the Bible on these issues of sin, that’s their business, but why undermine and discredit those who do believe it IS sin.
The vicious attacks for anyone who leaves the “gay” life is very un-Christian.
You were “depressed” because you’re denying your true self. To thine own self be true. If you think you can be cured, you have a very good chance of committing suicide. Stop being a little bitch and come out of the closet.
Wow Kelly! You quoted right out if Anton Levay’s “The Book of Satan”. Their main focus is “do what they will shall be the whole of the law”. I don’t think I need to explain any further how absolutely unBiblical your advice is or how destructive and untrue everything you wrote is.
That was a moronic and uninformed statement and accusation. Anton levay wrote a book of prose not a spiritual text! There is no such thing as a satanist religion. Christians would like to believe that there is. Bcause in order to be a satanist one would have to be Christian because believing in Satan would require a belief in god. Anton Levay is a poet and an atheist. He believed in the potential of humans. The satanist bible is not a bible and it has nothing to do with Satan. It has to do with humans loving both themselves and each other. It was a call to humankind to stop hiding their prejudices under the guise of ignorance. The people who are encouraging this poor young man to continue on a path of lying to himself are so irresponsible. There seems to be a whole lot of bearing false witness going on amongst christians. You people are NO different than Fred phelps and the rest of the westboro baptist church spiritual terrorists. It’s amazing how you all can turn a beautiful religion into a fascist organization. If Christianity is so “selfless” doesn’t it seem wrong to believe that mere human beings can know for sure how god or Jesus meant things esp considering mere mortals wrote the bible. You all worship at the church of self rather than the church of god. It seems rather ungodly to believe that YoUR way or interpretation is the only way or absolute truth! You despise Anton levy but he “preaches” in his book EXACTLY what you are “practicing”. You are humans not GOD, you can’t possibly know anything to be absolute truth!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Kelly, I don’t know what else to say except that idea is a complete lie.
So if a man has a thing for underage girls, how should he be true to himself?
He should be true to himself by acknowledging his romantic feelings, but should never take advantage of someone. That should be true no matter his age.
And if he has no feelings for adults who can comprehend, consent, and equivocate, then he may lead a life alone, while acknowledging that even if he were to date a girl, she would grow up and he would fall out of his feelings for her.
Matt, just know I certainly am praying for you. Lean heavily on God our Father and His Word, that is where your strength, wisdom and guidance comes from. Rest in God’s loving arms and His amazing love for you, my brother.
Stan
Praying for you, Matt, that you can keep busy and seek masculine affirmation from straight Christian brothers. God is the one who can heal the old wound and his love is unconditional, and He won’t turn you away.
Matt,
My heart aches for you. I understand the deep depression and mental anguish that goes along with being a practicing Christian and experiencing same sex attraction. I decided when I was 19 that I would try to forsake the “gay lifestyle” but my avoidance of any emotional intimacy drove me crazy (Diagnosis of OCD). After medicine and a regular counseling regimen, I was able to function somewhat normally. What did not change was my belief that somehow I was disgusting and sinful for things that were ultimately out out of my control, namely my sexual attraction.
I found freedom in trusting in the undying, unconditional love of the Father. I learned that my attraction and desire to love another man does not sever my tie to the infinite and incomprehensible. My love for my partner only helps me to grow in deeper fellowship with God. When one lives a life as a fundamentalist Christian, he loses the greatest fundamental of following the Lord Jesus Christ, sanctifying love. The foundation of the Christian faith is love: Love of God, Love of Neighbor and Love of Self (1 Cor 13:13). It is God’s love and the divine life that we can access the depths of that great mystery. The Acts of the Apostles reads “In [God] we live and move and have our being.” Hear the call of God and live in his mercy and love, not judgement and hell-fire.
Lastly, identify that thing that makes your attraction so morally reprehensible. How does it offend another person? Why would God be offended? When a relationship is based on love and the virtue of total self giving, then you are doing the will of God. Those precepts that we read in Levitical Law and those Pauline proscriptions that we find in the epistles are a part of an age that no longer exists. Do you attend congregations that allow women to preach or to worship without headscarves? (Read: 1 Timothy 2:12 and 1 Corinthians 11:6). Do you know Christians that divorce and remarry? (Read: Luke 16:18) Most contemporary Christian congregations do not follow these laws. They are not edifying to the body of Christ and cause many to fall into sin. Take one step further and know that God wants the best for you and the man with whom He may bless you (Rom 8:31).
Be encouraged. It’s a hard journey to know and understand the love of God. I am still marching toward it. Know that God’s will is not found in your self-deprecation and mental anguish. “Where the spirit of the Lord is, there is liberty”, including your love life.
In Christ,
Troy
Your words, are smooth, earthly, natural and demonic.
Romans 1:28
Expanded Bible (EXB)
28 [L And since/just as] People did not ·think it was important [consider it worthwhile; see fit] to ·have a true knowledge of [or acknowledge] God. So God ·abandoned them to [allowed them to pursue; gave them over to] ·their own worthless thinking [a depraved/corrupted mind] to do things they should not do.
Thanks Al!
“Whoever is of God hears the words of God. The reason why you do not hear them is that you are not of God.” -John8:47
Demonic how?
And why did you quote Romans where Paul was talking to Romans about how they worshipped other Gods and idols in the shapes of animals? How is that relevant to this conversation?
Amen. Anyone who says gay is okay after reading Romans 1 needs a heart check. I strongly believe homosexual behavior is of the devil simply because it’s unnatural. God created us to love and marry the opposite sex – and have children by them. That’s how God designed our bodies, period. Any sexual behavior that cannot biologically lead to children is sinful – gay or straight. It’s all about the next generation (unselfish). The devil wants our kids, via abortion and homosexuality and pedophilia/sex trafficking. He wants to destroy the godly seed.
“The devil wants our kids, via abortion and homosexuality and pedophilia/sex trafficking.”
You need help. Run, don’t walk, to the nearest mental health center. Print up the comment that I’m replying to. If the intake person doesn’t feel your state is fragile enough for immediate assistance, show them the comment. They’ll take you in no questions asked.
Then feel free to recommend a doctor for a heart check for me. After Reading Romans 1, I understood that idolatry is bad, and worshipping idols in the forms of animals can lead to a vast majority of sins including participating in shrine sex orgies (as the Romans used to do to honor fertility gods/ godesses).
You’re free to believe that something is of the devil simply because it’s unnatural, such as computers, eyeglasses, tattoos, and the millions of other man-made things out there.
God created us to love. He created us diverse: male, female, intersexed, transgender, gay, straight, bisexual… and all of these people should find the person that God chose for them.
You’re free to believe that only unprotected sex between two fertile people is good, and that all other sex is sinful, when using condoms, past menopause, or with someone who had their uterus removed or tubes tied. I think responsible sex is all about the next generation, to make sure that when you have kids you are ready, and can take care of them the best you can.
I feel that might be a bit too much logic for this crowd Alex but I appreciate your efforts!
Sure use the same reprobate argument to justify being an unrepentant sinner. Your false joy and self-righteousness have no power over me. God will not be mocked whatever you sow in this life you will reap in the next at the Judgment seat. But it doesn’t matter to you really because God has allowed your mind to fall off the deep end, so that you are even unable to repent. You are a spiritually blind man trying to lead others and your both going to fall in a pit.
I don’t believe any such argument he posted is reprobate, or that is can be used to justify one who is unrepentant from when they sin, such as when they steal or rape or murder.
And I don’t understand that is joy is false, nor that he is being self-righteous – I did not see any holier than thou attitude in his post, though I must admit yours seems a bit self-righteous! And I don’t think he was attempting to put any power over you, so I do not know why you felt that.
You’re absolutely right that God will not be mocked, and he seems very ready for that and to be judged by Him! How wonderful.
It seems instead that your arguments apply more to fear and hate than to having the love of Christ speaking through you, which is on it’s face quite something to be worried about!
Thanks for being a voice of reason Alex!
Troy, you’ve allowed yourself to be utterly deceived. God help you.
@Shirl Matthew 16:23
Alex you don’t understand because you are unable to. If we can’t agree that God’s Word plainly says homosexuality is a sin, then I don’t need to give an explanation. Go ahead follow Troy and the rest of satan’s liars into a Hell. You know the Bible talked about people like you 2700 years ago. Wanna see your future. God even knows what is going to be in your mind (in the future), because you will ponder this in Hell while you will look at satan when he is brought to his lowest.
Isaiah 14:16-17
New American Standard Bible (NASB)
16 “Those who see you will gaze at you,
They will ponder over you, saying,
‘Is this the man who made the earth tremble,
Who shook kingdoms,
17 Who made the world like a wilderness
And overthrew its cities,
Who did not allow his prisoners to go home?’
I don’t care if you think I am attacking in “fear” and “hate” you are not going to drag a brother in Christ (Matt Moore) down with you will false lies and promises.
Genesis 3:1
New American Standard Bible (NASB)
3 Now the serpent was more crafty than any beast of the field which Yahweh God had made. And he said to the woman, “Indeed, has God said, ‘You shall not eat from any tree of the garden’?”
Indeed, you are of your father satan…….
Satan doesn’t exist. Next!
Ah, so this is another thing where you can’t understand unless you already believe as you do, and if you don’t there is no explaining. It doesn’t make logical sense, so it relies on belief.
Some people believe as you do, that God’s word is meant to be taken as you say it, and that we aren’t supposed to examine what it means – literalism is the only way to read the Bible, from beginning to end. I don’t believe that, but you are free to.
I have no need to follow Satan’s liars into a Hell. The Bible talked about many people, not just people like me, but people like you. It is not up to us to judge. I know my future as best I can, because I have a relationship with God. And yes, God knows what is in my mind in the past, the present, and the future.
Thank you for your “concern.” Peace be with you, I hope God helps you find it.
And you are right, that I am not going to drag a brother in Christ with false lies and promises, as I have no need to. I made no lies, and no promises, which is quite clear. I don’t promise anything, as only Matt can choose his own path.
Troy,
God may have given you enough grace such that you have an emotionally intimate relationship with another man while avoiding buggery, but God does not give that grace to everyone. For most people, it is better just to avoid such relationships altogether because the temptation for buggery is great.
Yes, listen to “brokenness restored”.. Christians who chose not to follow what the Bible, and Jesus, taught about this ought NOT entice others to do the same. They’ll have to answer to God for what they do, but if they mislead anyone they’ll have a greater sin to answer for. Stay strong, keep the faith, you are truly amazing and God LOVES you Matt.
Matt – You need to accept the fact that you’re gay. Seriously, you need to find a gay-affirming church and start living your life, Dude. I know, I’ve lived it!!! Been in your shoes, my friend…
He is living his life by seeking refuge in God and resisting temptation.
We cannot resist temptation. God is the only one capable of setting us free from temptation.
Matt.
Thank you for your transparency. I will be praying for you. Please know that your willingness to share your true heart is not lost, even in your struggles. God is faithful and He will not leave you. Continue on your path seeking wisdom, honest feedback, and direction from those who want the best for you.
I recognize so much of your situation as it is similar to the one my husband walks every day.
Know that you are dear to us as fellow sojourners.
In His Grip– just like you are!!
Gretchen
So very sorry for you Gretchen, to be married to a gay man must be heartbreaking. Do you really believe that is what God wants? A union between two people who are not sexually compatible?
I feel sorry for both of them. Were it not for the people who convinced the man that he was “broken” and in need of fixing he most likely would not have married this woman. I’ve met so many like him, and her. They got into relationships, sometimes both of them knowing the truth, thinking that god’s love would “fix” him and make their marriage work. They’re told it’s “what he wants.” When it fails, as it most always does, people blame them for not trying hard enough. Not praying hard enough. Not being “true” christians. It’s so easy for them isn’t it? They judge, even though they’re told not to. They point fingers and tell others how to live their lives. In the end, lives are ruined and in tatters.
The Bible proclaims, ‘In God ALL things are possible” so for you to say that God can’t change you is to say you know more than God and that we should believe those of you who have been deluded into thinking that your affliction is normal and healthy, when God says it’s not.
AMEN.
You ditched my first comment, is your blog.
Have you noticed how the people you turn to help are also using you to further THEIR agendas???
I have no agenda here, other than recognizing someone in a similar situation that I was in.
Just because you are gay doesn’t mean you have sex with everyone, every day. Is possible to just be friends, too….
Am not trying confuse you, am trying to light a path. You said you were tired of always feeling the need to be forgiven, that is guilt working on you. As a Catholic, I know it well.
Please, if you listen to nothing else, these religious folks that use you at conferences and such to share your story are USING you, in a far worse way than you’ve been used before. You don’t need to be fixed, you need to accept yourself.
If you really want to know who your friends are, tell them you ARE gay and see who sticks around. THOSE are your friends.
I fear you confuse being gay with being promiscuous, doesn’t have to be that way. Life is more than sex, for straight and gay people.
This is your struggle, and I won’t diminish it, as I remember being where you are. There comes a point that you just have to accept who you are and have FAITH that God knew what HE was doing when he made you.
WHO YOU CHOOSE TO LOVE does NOT define you, is only important that you DO love.
Best of Luck, God Speed!!
wow Rick because you really know us well enough to make such a statement.
thank you
Matt if u r unhappy because u r not perfect then u will continue to be unhappy! The Scripture says that all have come short of the glory of GOD! Even the most experienced Christian fails & is imperfect! That’s just a fact. There is no extra points for continued repentance! Jesus heard you the first time and remembers that sin NO MORE! THERE IS SO MUCH I WANT TO TELL YOU SINCE I’VE WALKED THAT SAME PATH. GOD HAS FORGIVEN YOU NOW YOU HAVE TO FORGIVE YOURSELF. Be strong my brother and I truly believe there is a lesson God wants you to learn from this! May the Lord reveal this to you and heal your wounded heart and spirit! U know how to reach me if u want to talk! With all brotherly love, Bryan Matthews
You’re gay! I don’t care what any religion says, mother nature made you attracted to the same gender! Some people are gay, get over it.
Matt I don’t know if you read all your comments if you do don’t listen to all these devils trying to tell you to go back and lose what they themselves can’t obtain but, Please Read This…..
Galatians 6
(NASB)
6 Brethren, even if anyone is caught in any trespass, you who are spiritual, restore such a one in a spirit of gentleness; each one looking to yourself, so that you too will not be tempted. 2 Bear one another’s burdens, and thereby fulfill the law of Christ.
Don’t go back Matt Moore, hold fast to Yeshua Hamashia.
Hebrews 6:4-15
New American Standard Bible (NASB)
4 For in the case of those who have once been enlightened and have tasted of the heavenly gift and have been made partakers of the Holy Spirit, 5 and have tasted the good word of God and the powers of the age to come, 6 and then have fallen away, it is impossible to renew them again to repentance, since they again crucify to themselves the Son of God and put Him to open shame. 7 For ground that drinks the rain which often falls on it and brings forth vegetation useful to those for whose sake it is also tilled, receives a blessing from God; 8 but if it yields thorns and thistles, it is worthless and close to being cursed, and it ends up being burned.
9 But, beloved, we are convinced of better things concerning you, and things that accompany salvation, though we are speaking in this way. 10 For God is not unjust so as to forget your work and the love which you have shown toward His name, in having ministered and in still ministering to the saints. 11 And we desire that each one of you show the same diligence so as to realize the full assurance of hope until the end, 12 so that you will not be sluggish, but imitators of those who through faith and patience inherit the promises.
13 For when God made the promise to Abraham, since He could swear by no one greater, He swore by Himself, 14 saying, “I will surely bless you and I will surely multiply you.” 15 And so, having patiently waited, he obtained the promise.
God has His best in store for you Matt, a GODLY WOMAN for His Word says.
Genesis 2:18
(NASB)
18 Then Yahweh God said, “It is not good for the man to be alone; I will make him a helper suitable for him.”
Don’t worry I’m still waiting on her too, we can wait together.
Last one.
Hebrews 6:18
(NASB)
18 so that by two unchangeable things in which it is impossible for God to lie, we who have taken refuge would have strong encouragement to take hold of the hope set before us.
Matt marrying a woman would be the biggest mistake he could make. Nobody wins.
By the way, read this link about your precious Yeshua:
http://www.aish.com/jw/s/48892792.html
Foolishness
Yes, Xtians are foolish
Hey Matt,
First off I don’t think you are being hypocritical. Have you ever said “I will never stumble”. That’s just it, non believers put us in a situation of having to be perfect people, but we are never going to be, we will struggle and it does get easier, but we will never be sinless. I understand how people think Christians are supposed to be these goody goody, never do anything wrong people, but we aren’t, and I think if more people understood this they would pursue God.
Second, I get what your saying about wanting to be “free” in your old lifestyle. I remember back when I used to smoke pot and drink on a regular, I know it was to numb, and I was “free” in the aspect of not having to think about my pain and dig in.
I remember over the summer I slipped and I got some liquor and a joint, I wanted to just let go for one night, and I sat in the backyard getting high and I started sobbing. So here I am trying to enjoy myself and let loose and I can’t because I felt so convicted and it did nothing but make me high and drunk ):
Living a Christ centered life is rough, but please understand, anyone who is reading this, anything that is hard and you accomplish brings so much satisfaction, right? So imagine pushing forward even when something gets hard with God, and accomplishing that, even if it’s going a couple years at a time walking in repentance, there is so much Joy. Imagine your happiest day and just try to multiply it by a billion, can’t imagine can you? That’s why we do it, that’s why I would never give up my Christianity to go back.
Matt, I also used to get depressed and God lead me to a Biblical counselor and God took me through a lot of intense healing. It has freed me of my depression and even if I feel it coming, I can see it miles away, I know how to fight it off quickly now.
You will be fine, God is leading you where you need to go for now, just walk one day at a time.
Matt…you have helped me so much…even now with this posting. As I type this I feel the same loneliness and depression you do. But you have helped me be strong in the Lord and I will pray for you and help in any way else I can with your new church in NOLA. Know that God protects those like you that are His and He will send many to help and be there for ya. Love u man.
First of All your a Christian who does not read or understand Aramaic ,and or Hebrew.So for you or any other Christian to interrupt Torah.Please go to a true scholar of G-d a Rabbi to understand the period and the place of the 10 commandments.Lets put this into perspective.The Jews were now free from Egyptians,and wondering in the desert for 40 years,and G-d wanted them to now build up there peoples population.
Now how you do this is by having sex and having children.So it was a decree from the Rabbis and leaders of the time to make it mandatory to not spill your seed on the ground or sleep with a Man like a women because they instructed there people to rebuild the Jewish population.This again was a decree by the leaders .
Now today the Jewish leaders welcome all Jews into their home as one people of the Lord .Not like Christians that speak with a split tongue.So castaway your venomous ways ,and except G-D himself as your righteous one ,and love thou Neighbor as thou self .Nor Judge one another only G-D will be the almighty Judge
You are gay and there’s nothing you can do about it. You can lie to yourself and you can try to hide it, but your heart is stronger than that and it will show you the truth. This is just an example of your heart showing your real feelings, that’s who you are and that’s how god made you. Why would you have a sinner heart? Why would god made you like that? Because there’s nothing wrong about it! Because being gay is not a sin! God made you like that because he doesn’t see anything wrong about that, and you shouldn’t either.
You dont have to explain why you did that Just stop trying to be someone that you are not, embrace what you really are and be happy, you are not in this world to suffer, and right now you are suffering.
Face it Matt you are gay, and until you accept that fact you will have nothing but sorrow and misery in your life. If you feel your faith is strong then seek a gay affirming Christian group for fellowship.
To thine own self be true, and if you are deceptive you will hurt many along life’s travels. Don’t believe the religious bigotry!
@matt, If I could advise you it would be two things. 1. Keep more of your private life private. 2. Keep evolving in your faith journey without giving in to self doubts. Militant left-wing media and LGBT affirmining trolls have a bulls eye on your back and it will get ugly…it’s in their nature. You must understand persons like you are a imminent threat to the ’cause’ and of ‘equality’.
@Davide: amazing how many trolls come out when subjects like this one is on the board…yet, VERY few will post their name and/or picture next to their comments. It’s easy to be a coward and hide behind closed profiles and slander a person. Very few are eloquent and virtually none come up with any validity to their comments…they stab and run. Typical, yet frustrating. Your suggestions and comments are (and have been) quite up front and you do a great job in providing facts when asked. Nicely done!
@Gene Jenkins,
Thanks for the kind words. I always look forward to reading your comments.
I’m not sure how it is LGBT affirming trolls show up here at such high numbers. Maybe the first one farts out a pheromone that attracts the others?
:) :) 
Sent from Uranus
@Davide – ” Very few are eloquent and virtually none come up with any validity to their comments” Reply – “I’m not sure how it is LGBT affirming trolls show up here at such high numbers. Maybe the first one farts out a pheromone that attracts the others?”
Very, very eloquent, Davide.
Word on the street (from Matt’s own mouth that is), Matt’s sold his computer and he’s had someone put a lock on his phone so he can’t download Grindr or any other apps like it. How is this any way to live? I know, I know, like-minded people will say that it’s SATAN who’s taken over him. Good grief! The boy needs help, and not the kind that he’s currently getting from his alleged pastor.
“I felt like all I was doing all the time was repenting and being sad and fearful and doubtful.”
This sounds like something that people say who’ve been involved with mind control cults.
Instead of trying to reject your sexual orientation, why don’t you reject your religious inculcation? The Bible is a man-made document filled with scientific and historical inaccuracies, omissions, holes, contradictions, forgeries, mistranslations, and outdated sets of rules. It was written centuries after the supposed events took place. Christianity as we know it wasn’t even unified until the council of Nicaea, and even afterwards Christianity is divided into thousands of sects. Not to mention the evidence for a historical Jesus is sketchy at best.
You are DEAD wrong about historical evidence for Jesus. And you would do well to take your cynicism elsewhere. You want to stay ignorant about our faith, you do so, but you have no business trying to tear down other ppl’s faith because you lack it.
Read Bart Ehrman’s book on the Bible and you’ll see how corrupted that book is.
And I’m the one ignorant about your faith?
read Lee Strobel’s “the case for Christ”
http://www.infidels.org/library/modern/jeff_lowder/strobel.html
Exactly right, Harr. He’s torturing himself over lies and fantasies made up by men to enslave other men. It’s so sad how the Church tortures those who follow their fantasies.
Where are you coming up with this kind of stuff? ” It’s so sad how the Church tortures those who follow their fantasies.” …are you kidding??
Actually, the testimonies were written within decades. I know people who can remember events clearly though they happened ages ago in their youth. It’s perfectly reasonable to accept the Biblical accounts of Jesus after a few decades passed.
There are no other sources that mention the life and death of Jesus, much less his supposed resurrection. Even the canonical gospels themselves have several omissions and inconsistencies.
What makes sexual temptation so special that one must embrace it?
If a man has the hots for his stepmother, should he go ahead and act upon it?
Sexual temptation? No, lust is not so special that one must embrace it. Sexual orientation is what we are talking about.
There is no sexual orientation for being attracted to stepmothers.
Hi Matt
There’s nothing wrong with being gay. Your unhappiness will recede when you accept this. There are many gay Christians. You need to find a community of people who accept you for who you are, not who they want you to be. I know you now all this, but I thought I would take the time to remind you that there are people out there that are not judgmental, that care.
John (centerofdistribution at gmail dot com)
Correct.
However, there is everything wrong with same-sex buggery.
Just say no to same-sex buggery.
Some people believe that. I don’t.
You’re free to your belief. And others who disagree are free to theirs.
@John, do you know how not only wrong but offensive you are when you say Christians, who believe what the Bible teaches, do not care??? but you do??? you have things you believe in right? does that make you judgmental? Do you believe in any limits or regulations re; sexuality at all? if so, does that make you “judgmental”? This type of reasoning is truly a LIE from hell.
Thank you. If you care for someone, you don’t judge them. You accept them for who they are. Many Christians accept gay people and do not condemn them. Matt needs to find people like this. He is obviously not happy right now.
Would you accept a man who shags underage girls?
If you had a fifteen-year-old daughter and a grown man wanted to shag her, would you accept him?
Totally understand how you feel there Matt! Temptation is everywhere! I also have had a moment when i feel exactly the way you did, wanting to go back to leading my old lifestyle. But i resisted. Not saying that i”m out of that thinking, there is still times when i start missing my ex(s) and the times we had and blah blah blah. But God is good, He will not tempt you beyond what you can take. So take heart Matt and lean on God in all the ways of ya life! Proverbs 3:5-10. Praying for you! Lets walk and fight this journey to wholeness together!
Sorry mistake there. “God will not allow you to be tempted beyond what you can take.”
Matthew, you have to change your focus and if this means STOP BLOGGING and study His Word and let Him teach you doctrines other than salvation, sin and the devil. GET TO KNOW HIM AND SIT AT HIS FEET FOR A SEASON AND STAY HIDDEN, then you will be stronger and know when and how to minister to those caught in same sex attraction. Love from a minister of reconciliation and repentance to those coming away from same sex attraction to the grace and mercy of Jesus Chrsit, Kathleen Malligan
That’s the plan.
God bless and give you the strength and wisdom you need in this time and as you study His Word and seek His will. Just tonight I was feeling so deeply that I must draw closer to His Word and let Him show me the truth I so desperately need.
Stan
I’m glad to hear that’s the plan. I have SO many opinions about this all – none you haven’t heard. Yes, I think – and hope – that you’ll come out of this accepting a new concept of God’s love. (Setting ‘the word’ above the spirit, is in and of itself a form of idolatry. Don’t fall into the trap of worshipping a book.) Stop thinking you know all the answers already and start ASKING God’s spirit to lead you. Stop being afraid of where the Spirit may lead.
But – Kathleen’s advice is wise. If nothing else, you need to stop being a proponent of ‘ex-gay’ ministry. Obviously, you are not mature enough in your faith to be a leader. Get offline, off the agenda and off Christian Post. Invest your time in serving people with a Christ-like spirit of anonymity. There are many ministries that actually meet people’s physical needs right there in New Orleans. Stop speaking at conferences and start to feed the hungry, clothe the poor, do some good at things I believe you have a heart for. Do that for a long season and THEN – you can come back to the ex-gay stuff – if that is still where you are.
Be well!
If that’s what you plan to do Matt, you should join a monastery or something.
I’m so relieved to hear you say that’s the plan Matt. The enemy thinks he’s got you in an extremely compromised position and is hard at work supplying a never ending army of trolls to finish the job of getting you to renounce the truth. Claim the authority Christ’s sacrifice has given you and rebuke those who would try and undo who you are in Christ. Kathleen and The Misfit have offered sound advice, and as always, pray without ceasing. God bless you Matt.
Bad plan Matt. You know this.
Good words, Kathleen. I hope and pray Matt does what you suggested.
Yes indeed. Do that and focus on the Word. All these secular opinions are like assholes: everyone has one, but they all stink!
I love the plan. Maybe I need to do the same – stop blogging and start reading and repenting…
You need to stop blogging and seek professional help.
God bless you for your honesty. Know that what you are doing is difficult, to live so openly, sharing so much of your private life. But God does forgive! I know you know that but I just want to remind you again and encourage you. You are doing the right thing in repenting. It may be embarrassing and humbling, but your repentance will draw you closer to God and teach you lessons about yourself. Don’t give up and don’t lose heart. Much love in Christ to you brother Matt.
I’m praying for you Matt, always. I hope that you pray for me as well. You always seem to touch home with me, like you’re speaking the words that are in my heart. I too suffer from depression and even more so it seems since I’ve been saved. Its like I’ve never been more sad than I am now and I feel guilty about it. I dont quite understand why because it always seemed to me that people who are in Christ seem so happy. But I pray a lot and have to believe that it’s a process that I’m not supposed to understand yet and that the best is surely to come. Thank you for your honesty. Love you!
I grew up in the Church and went to Metro Christian Center in Orange County Ca where this conversion stuff started. Thankfully I had left that church 2 weeks before Exodus ministries was launched. 10 years later I saw the founder at a gay bar and by that time he had turned against that ministry. I spoke with him and he said that his claims of coversion were all a lie, fueled by guilt and shame.
There is no such thing as conversion, only the torture of a gay human being at the hands of those in the church. It isn’t easy growing up gay and Christian. It was a horrific experience for me. Thankfully I have left the church and found my relationship with God, a relationship that is built on my own love for him and not determined, driven, directed or shaped by others.
I pray that you find peace in the perfection of your creation. God made you exactly as you are, not to become different but to live fully as his unique creation.
Looking out for you brother. Being gay is a gift from God. Your have a role in the human race. You are loved from God. You are too young to understand this gift but in time you will. Human love and wellness will lift you from any past teachings of negativity. God gave you a heart and mind to evolve as a human being on your own. Follow your heart not past human teachings of negativity. Trust me and have faith.
Thanks for the honesty Matt, it’s so refreshing to hear Christians being honest about struggles and telling it like it is – that being changed is a process! A life-long process! This idea that once we accept Christ we suddenly have everything all sorted out and all our issues and temptations removed is not correct. As you have mentioned before, the real power is that God continues to change us every day, not just once. Bless you, and am praying for you.
Praying for you brother.
cydney
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WordPress.com
Matt Moore posted: “I want to address what I’m sure most of you have already seen on the internet: my profile on Grindr. For those of you who don’t know, Grindr is an app designed specifically for gay men. It shows you where the other gay guys (who also have grindr) are arou”
Dude, you’re gay. Get over yourself.
You’re young, intelligent and free to live your life the way God intended it, you know….the way he made you, as a gay man.
Stop wasting your time back tracking for being caught and live your life and share God’s love with your gay fellow Christians.
I pray for you.
When did God MAKE anyone gay? Where was that in the Creation design – you know, before the Fall in Genesis 3?
I’m gay. I didn’t choose to be gay. I was born gay. There are lots of things that exist in the world today that weren’t in the bible – you know, before the Fall in Genesis 3?
@ matt, i almost forgot..you might consider ending blogging. And our faith is not about doom and gloom its about joy and peace. I am deeply sadden by the hatred and malice some have brought to bare against you here. But I have always been certain this is your Golgotha, your martydom. Hang tough and you are in my prayers.
You’re so gay, just give it a rest and be true to yourself.
What if he already is?
Matt, Off the bat you suffer from depression because you see the truth but continue to deny your true self….You are not alone, its one of the reasons we invented Gay Pride. If it is said that God created the universe, then God created man ergo God created gay. Being Gay is not a sin it occurs naturally in many species God created. What is a “sin” is to ignore or try to rewrite what God created all because another man or woman tells you they see it as such..To grow to understand oneself is to take pride in what God has made you..you are his creation…to deny yourself is to turn your back on God.God is all around you
There is nothing in the “whole of creation” from the beginning to the end of the Bible, of God’s Truth that supports what you just said. From the making of our bodies the way that they function to every Word God spoke at the time He created man and woman to and throughout out the Bible and in all time, there is nothing consistent with the rationalized untruth you just spoke… nothing.. The Truth is… God made man and woman, He made them for each other and He never made man for man and woman for woman, it is consistently throughout the whole BIBLE. The fact is, you would not even be here today without TRUTH being played out as God created you in your mother’s womb from a seed planted by your father as it was written and designed by your Father God! Consistently throughout the bible and infinitely so… God proves HIs creation of man for woman and woman for man and together He created them individually for each other. You can change your “reality” of what truth is to fit your desires to rationalize that you are not a sinner, but the truth is we all are… we all have the “human condition” that wants to do what “feels” good to ourselves, that wants to do its own thing. We are enticed by evil, we have been from day one when Eve chose to follow after the temptation that what God said was not enough. I am no different from you, I am married, for 35 years in a happy marriage, but I still am tempted and enticed, but I love God more than I want temporary pleasure that gains me nothing eternal. Taking pride never works with God, He resists the proud and he draws near the humble. Nothing “feels” right in this world but TRUTH, God’s TRUTH and HIS Redemption, it feels like no other… http://youtu.be/1Qwyot158wM So “man up” and face the reality that you are a sinner, just like all of us, you have to fight the good fight of faith, resist it and go God’s Way. We never “accept” that we feel “different”, We accept JESUS, we cling to HIM because in His Way, Truth And Life is our future! Clinging to what you “want” is easy, and following your feelings, so easy, rewriting truth… would love to do that myself, would make my life so easy, BUT as much as we try to mess with TRUTH to make it fit our viewpoint, the Kingdom Perspective stands. Truth is truth and whether we believe it or not, whether we “spin” it so we can sin in peace, it is still GOD’s TRUTH. Nothing changes TRUTH, not you, not me, not anything changes Gods TRUTH. They coolest thing about God’s Truth is it does not have to be proven. He proves it as He will to you on this side of heaven or not, one way you will face God and He will prove HIS Truth to you.
That’s your opinion. Many who follow God have different opinions. You’ve obviously done all of your bible study and you’ve got the language just right. Good for you. The thing is, there’s a whole world out there that thinks differently.
I am gay. Born gay. Live an open, honest, happy gay life with my partner of 23 years. We were married 7 years ago when marriage equality was made the law of the land in Canada. I don’t live the “homosexual lifestyle” that Matt allegedly “left” after he tired of non-stop drinking and having one-night stands with complete strangers. My husband and I are monogamous and wouldn’t have it any other way. I’m an atheist, so I don’t spend my time worrying whether or not some god approves of my life. I wake up every day with a positive attitude and I do my best to live a good, honest life. If I’m somehow wrong and I do meet up with god on judgement day, that’s when we’ll have that conversation. Until them, I’m good.
What I’m not good with is Matt telling people he “left the homosexual lifestyle” when he’s done nothing but lie and be deceitful. He blogs about gay people as though we’re less-than because we’re not as “good” as him. Wrong! Matt’s done things that I’ve never even contemplated. He needs help, and not the kind he’s found being the member of a cult.
The fact that hermaphrodites exist makes your whole wall-of-text argument null
I pray that you will someday learn to separate your sexual orientation from your faith. As a Gay Christian, I am confident that God intends for me to live my life openly, and in a manner that is pleasing to him (aka moral, monagamous). God loves you, and I hope and pray for your journey in faith.
Again, I have to honour you for the utter transparency. If more men and women of God were open about their failures, the world would be a better place and those living in the world would feel more welcome in the physical church.
I would also like to propose this: stop labeling yourself as a homosexual. Those of us who are born again are ALL sinners saved by grace, but it doesn’t mean that we have to continue to label ourselves as what we did. Even if what we did was as recent as the week-end.
I believe that this continuance in labeling yourself as a homosexual might very well be an open door to the enemy to continue to have a foothold in your life because you are continuing to identified with a sinful life that he has created and that is attempting to deter you from your purpose as a man of God.
I am not saying that your feelings and emotions for other men would automatically go away. Not in the least. However, what I am saying is that we are to bring our thoughts captive to the obedience of Christ until we truly have the mind of Christ. We are to renew our minds daily with His word and fellowship with Him. And once repented–which you are–”there is therefore now NO condemnation to those that are in Christ Jesus and are called according to His purpose.”
That’s YOU Matt.
So be encouraged!! God loves you. I love you. So many people out there that don’t even know you love you.
And I will continue to pray for you as Christ prayed for His disciples: not that God would take you out of the world, but that you would be kept from the evil one.
I know I just preached so I hope you don’t mind. I just wanted to encourage you!
God bless you and keep you!!
I hope you can find the strength to understand that God’s love includes you, even as you are. Please stop torturing yourself. You’ve been pushed around far too long by a hateful church that bends the words of the Bible to justify discrimination. Matt, parts of the Bible were meant as description of the laws current at the time. The same way can say homosexuality is okay is the same way one can say the laws governing taking a slave in the Bible were wrong.
I hope you can find God’s love instead of continuing to be misled by those who say they are speaking for God but are really speaking out against who you were created to be.
Your “confession” and clarification makes me so sad, Matt. Because you are taking completely the wrong message from what you’ve done. The only sin you are committing is denying your true self. You know this. You said it yourself. You’re tired of feeling guilty and depressed. Do you think that’s the life God really wants for you? To “serve” him, and be miserable while your proving to God and everyone around you that you are a true Christian fighting the good fight! It’s such a bunch of crap! God wants you to be happy. God doesn’t care who you sleep with. God cares if, when you see a man lying in the street, do you help him out, or do you steal his wallet. And you are stealing from yourself…stealing precious time, stealing energy and happiness from yourself, stealing from the world by withholding your real, authentic, true self from the rest of us. Look at the Bible for what it really is…it’s a guide book. It’s a book of METAPHORS, not a history book. The messiah isn’t “our there” in heaven, he is inside of you. He is you! Man…wake up. This is the only life you get. And you’re wasting precious, precious time torturing yourself for an idea that belongs to a people and a culture and a way of life that existed 2000 years ago. Matt…God doesn’t care about homosexuality. It isn’t a sin anymore than a disobediant child is being “sinful” or getting a haircut is being sinful, or touching a woman who’s in the time of her menstruation. Those are old ideas for a time long, long past. You are such a gorgeous, beautiful man. You should be out there being YOU and finding a man who will love you in the way God loves you…just as you are. I hope your recent actions will open your eyes to the real truth you are seeking. It’s almost as if God is saying to you “Matt, it’s okay! Be who you were born to be! My beautiful, humble, gay child. I love you just as you are. Stop this nonsense of forcing yourself into depression and lies and guilt. Don’t fear. Live! Love! Be happy!”
Have you lost your mind Gabriel? Yes, God DOES care about who you sleep with! The covenant of marriage is a reflection of the fidelity between Jesus and the church.
Also, God is more concerned about our holiness, than our happiness. He wants us to have JOY, but that is different from happiness. Joy comes in being abandoned to God. We struggle because our nature rebels against God, but thank Jesus, He died for ALL of our sins: past, present and future.
We die to ourself, not to be saved, but glorify God with our lives in submission to Him.
You know “marriage” in the Bible includes polygamy, rape, slaves, incest, and even child brides? So God doesn’t care about who you sleep with as long as it’s not people of the same sex.
Nice moral guide you have.
The Bible never ever condones rape, did it include polygami, yes, and it speaks against slavery (read the letter to Philemon), child brides? that one you just made up. The Israelites had laws about sexuality, not just the pohibition against homosexulity but incest (so why do you even bring that up? a description of what happens does not mean God condoned it – learn to separate the two), and sex before marriage for example. Why come on this blog to blast the Bible? and the whole point about one man – one woman, is because that is how God created humans to be together (i.e. your not born gay). You violate His plan when you go against it. Jesus wasn’t even for divorce because of this. He said it was allowed because of the hardness of our hearts. One thing Matt does NOT have is a hardened heart. You should learn from him.
No Marcus, I haven’t lost my mind, but thanks for your concern. I decided early in life to use the brain and the compassion God gave me to navigate my way in the world instead of letting other people (or their intrepretations of a 2000 year-old book) tell me how I should be living. I think it’s pretty presumptuous of me or you to say what God wants. However, I choose to believe God wants all of his children to be happy, or joyful, whatever word you want to use. Perhaps I’m wrong. God is certainly a mystery greater than we’ll ever be able to wrap our minds around. Even if you rely on the Bible as your sole guide for life, Christ made it super simple for us. He was asked, “what is the greatest commandment?” And he answered, “Love the lord your God and love your neighbor as yourself.” It’s actually pretty simple.
IluvYHWH, Abraham married his half sister. ABRAHAM. God never punished anyone for incest.
Also, Mary was 12 or 13 years old when she became impregnated by God.
Just admit your holy book has outdated and messed up values
yeah, and the Mosaic Law came after that. Get the chronology right. and where does it say Mary’s age? she was young, but nowhere does it say she was that young. So, not much of a counter argument.
It was ancient Hebrew custom for girls to marry as soon as puberty started (sometimes before that)
What I mean to say is, God will love you as a gay man. It’s only people who will hate you. I hope you can find the strength to move forward and be comfortable with being gay. There are many people who will meet you with forgiveness and love should you renounce the lie of the closet.
Matt, just came across this verse. I have been struggling tonight with wanting to drink and I realized why this came on all the sudden for me.
1 Corinthians 9:27 No, I beat my body and make it my slave so that after I have preached to others, I myself will not be disqualified for the prize.
We have to beat ourselves into submission, but also, we are attacked hard when we are following God hard, Satan wants us to stop.
I heard a woman on Moody talk about how she was a speaker and ran a ministry and she would have loved to just veg and watch TV after she spoke, but she knew that her Spirit had to be refreshed, or refueled and she needed to spend time with God to do so, because we are so worn and weak after we give of ourselves when we minister that we need God to fill up what we gave away, so we can stand up to attack.
I just joined an addiction group called celebrate recovery, they probably have one near you to, and I know that’s why I want to drink tonight.
But God was faithful and gave me a way out and focused me on the blessing I will receive if I keep walking, doesn’t mean I don’t have to beat myself a bit tonight though (:
I remember a couple years ago I wanted to drink so bad, I locked myself in the house and walked around like a caged animal for hours, I finally called a woman from Church and she prayed and I instantly felt peace pour down around me and I listened to Worship music and felt Joy the rest of the night. Felt like I could relate to when Jesus was being tempted by Satan and after God sent angels to tend to Him.
Serious Matt you are Gay by G_d’s plan, and stop the deception to yourself. Eventually you will be found out and to have deceived all these people…. that’s the horrible direction you are heading… how will you handle the landside of guilt?
I know were you are as you are going through a similar way with the struggles. Yet unlike you I am not public about it. Not even anyone at my church knows about it. It is between me and God. I have gone through ex gay ministries yet I did not get cured of it. After I left these programs my homosexual desires still very strong and doing stuff no different than prior to attending the ex gay ministries. Yet after that experience I stopped going to Church all together. What started to change my outlook again was attend church again. Anyway the Church never mentions homosexuality and the main message of the Church is to praise God and worship him. The more I got into God word and worshiping him, the more I noticed my homosexual desires have declined. I not the same person anymore what I used to. I have even knocked back sexual advances from guys I find sexually attractive and available.
Matt, I know you probably have many emails so you don’t need to reply- I just wanted to tell you that you I have been praying for you often and want to encourage you to stay strong in The Lord. This life is passing by quickly and we will be in a redeemed, sinless body soon!!!
In Romans 7, Paul talks about our battle with sin and it is a fierce battle. Sometimes I get frustrated with my own sins…. But lately I have been reading revelation 21 and 22…. I constantly need to remind myself of the ending, and that gives me strength to keep fighting the battle. Revalation 20… Sin and death is cast into the lake of fire forever…. Can you imagine such a world where we can’t help but NOT sin?!? Your story has gone national… I know and pray God has some awesome plans to work all of it for his glory and our good. Praise God, stay strong
I seriously cannot believe that you people live in the same country as I do. You realize that our president, who supports gay marriage, just won re-election with 5 million votes, right? That gay marriage is legal in New York, Iowa, Washington, New Hampshire, Vermont, Connecticut, Maryland, the District of Columbia and Massachusetts. The most populous state in the nation, California, has civil unions, along with many other states. A majority of people in the country support same-sex marriage. You can preach about your wrongfully hateful vision of our loving God all you want but just realize that your views represent a minority in the country and a minority that is getting smaller by each passing day. In 50 years people will look back and realize that people with views like you were an embarrassment to our country.
Seriously, 5 million votes??? It was actually 65,899,660 for Obama and 60,932,152 for Romney. Don’t kid yourself, not everyone who voted for Obama is in favor of homosexuality. Majorities don’t dictate right and wrong, Dan, so be sure of what you believe based upon facts rather than mob mentality. It matters not what people of 50 years from now think, what matters most is where we will be spending eternity. We won’t have a second chance to live this life again.
Wow…..what a strong argument. You realize that the difference between 5 million votes and 4,957,508 votes is only a differential of less than 1% right? Maybe if you people had a decent education system in your backwater states you’d understand. Also, don’t kid yourself, same-sex marriage now has majority approval in the United States. I know it’s hard to accept but you do live in the same nation as San Francisco, New York, Los Angeles, Seattle, Chicago and Denver. America isn’t just your poor and undeveloped hick states. You hateful people don’t come close to forming any sort of majority and even the Republican Party realizes that.
your certainly know what hateful is, Dan!
For the love of God, stop beating yourself up and be true to who you are. Enough!
Everybody, everyday, makes and follows through with decisions that don’t align with the Bible. Knowingly or without knowledge. To judge someone b/c they fall short of the Glory of God and not judge ourselves is where the argument here is incredibly flawed. I reply not to change you mind, but to help you understand that people who are gay didn’t make the choice to be gay. It’s a choice that was predetermined for us. Now don’t get me wrong, I don’t claim God “wanted” me to gay. Just as I don’t think God wanted some people born with both sexual genitalia, or more than two chromosomes, or diabetic, or with a heart that is outside the body, or connected to their twin, but that is the card that is handed to them, just as that is the card that is handed to us. It is who we are, and who we will always be. God will love me and absolve me of all my sins b/c his Son died to strengthen me, to Save me! And to that I am eternally thankful, although I don’t think I deserve it. But it is exactly me who he came to save. I hope that one day, all Christians will love and accept all differences.
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Matt,
Beware of heeding the whisperings of the enemy & the counsel of despair.
For your encouragement –
“Rejoice not over me, O my enemy;
when I fall I shall rise; when I sit in darkness, the Lord will be a light to me”
Micah 7 v 8
Matt, I’m praying for you! You are doing the right thing. It’s NOT easy. Jesus never said it would be. It wasn’t for him. But you will find joy on that road. I know that. Don’t give up, don’t give in! In God’s presence is fullness of joy! It’s real, I’ve experienced it! So will you!
Actually, Jesus did in fact say that His burden is easy and His yoke is light. Unless of course you don’t believe the bible to be an accurate representation of what Jesus said, in which case we know nothing about what He said and it’s all a moot point. It is religion that keeps people miserable, not Jesus.
I am not sure what your agenda is by blogging what should be a personal journey with Christ. It really doesn’t help when you publicize such slip like this (I am not condemning the slip itself though, because it happens understandably and it’s your deal ultimately) or get exposed. I just want you to know inadvertently you have advertised Grindr for people who are on the same struggle, but don’t even know what the app is about. You have stirred up the curiosity, and thanks to you, people will visit the site and fall to explore the unwanted possibilities. You are in a long haul, and you should be working this through personally, or with a group of people you can trust privately instead of sharing it with strangers in cyberspace what ups and downs you’ve been going through, and what gay apps you’ve been exploring lately even though you knew it’s a sin. Please understand this doesn’t help anyone at all. It seems like you are doing this for some fame, attention and projects to work on. It’s hard to take it seriously, it’s hypocritical, the very criticism that Christians often receive, and seems quite self-absorbed behavior for now. If you are in it truly to witness His power and will in your life consider some other venue to go about it.
Wes,
I get some of your points but there is a natural desire for new believers to share their hope so others can find it. Honesty is about not about advertising but willingness to be transparent instead of trying to deny the sin that we have committed. I seriously questioned your sincerity since you publicly did this in front of unbelievers instead of privately confronting Matt first as Christ exhorted us to do. Lets be real that anyone who takes a public stand for Christ especially leaving the gay lifestyle is going hammered by satan to use it as tool to discredit his message or the power of the gospel. I find that most of my spiritual battles intensified when I take a stance for Christ. The reality that our walk with Christ will never stop having battles even after years of victory so each day we all need to prepare for spiritual battle. The world is watching and they wanting so badly so use any of our falls and our actions as an excuse for their sin.
good comment freedomcampus.
Much too harsh – and wrong! We must be transparent because we’re not perfect. I never heard of Grindr before this week and I certainly won’t use it now – not interested…
But God hath chosen the foolish things of the world to confound the wise; and God hath chosen the weak things of the world to confound the things which are mighty; And base things of the world, and things which are despised, hath God chosen, yea, and things which are not, to bring to nought things that are: That no flesh should glory in his presence. ~ 1 Corinthians 1:27-29, KJV
And he said unto me, My grace is sufficient for thee: for my strength is made perfect in weakness. Most gladly therefore will I rather glory in my infirmities, that the power of Christ may rest upon me. Therefore I take pleasure in infirmities, in reproaches, in necessities, in persecutions, in distresses for Christ’s sake: for when I am weak, then am I strong. ~ 2 Corinthians 12:9-10, KJV
Praying for you Matt to be who God meant…He loves you and sends his Holy Spirit to comfort and give you strength. We are all sinners. Please surround yourself with good Christian men and women to support you. And please remember “There is no condemnation in the Lord”. Love you, but not as much as He does. Believe in you.
I had a friend who was told by their family to “straighten” up or get out. He choose to hang himself. After my “straightening up” attempt and suicide attempt, I decided to allow myself to be Me. How’s the “straightening” up working for you Matt?
On the most basic levels, I desire fullness, and fleshly lusts seduce me by attaching themselves to this basic desire. They exploit the empty spaces in me, and they promise that fulness will be mine if I give in to their demands. When my soul sits empty and is aching for something to fill it, such deceptive promises are extremely difficult to resist.
Consequently, the key to mortifying fleshly lusts is to eliminate the emptiness within me and replace it with fullness; and I accomplish this by feasting on the gospel. Indeed, it is in the gospel that I experience a God who glorifies Himself by filling me with His fullness. This is the God of the gospel, a God who is satisfied with nothing less than my experience of fullness in Him!
Indeed, as I perpetually feast on Christ and all His blessings found in the gospel, I find that my hunger for sin diminishes and the lies of lust simply lose their appeal. Hence, to the degree that I am full, I am free. Eyes do not rove, nor do fleshly lusts rule, when the heart is fat with the love of Jesus!
— Milton Vincent
Well said! We need the fullness of Jesus. I don’t have it cause I’m looking for love in all the wrong places, trying to fill the emptiness and assuage the grief (dead father, bad mother).
I understand the struggle you must feel, and I wish you the best of luck in resolving it. Or, if you don’t think it can be resolved, to be as happy and as full as you can find yourself, whatever that course may be for you. Everyone deserves that, and I believe God wants that for everyone.
Many people’s paths through a struggle with their feelings are different, and I hope you are happy with yours. My path ended with me with a loving partner, great step-son, great family, and much support. And after three years, we are planning our life together: a home, marriage, and to extend our family. I can see nothing but great things for us.
I wish great things – and not what’s great for me, or anyone else, but what’s great for you – in your future.
Alex
rubydraggon@yahoo.com
Matt, praying for you! You know this a process. And this fall was no surprise to God. His grace is sufficient. Even for this. Your transparency is allowing folks to see God working in your life. You have not let “us” down, this is between you and God. Take care of yourself first. Focus on your journey with Christ.
From a fellow struggler.
i’ll pray that you free yourself from what society has taught you. love yourself and who you were born to be. JESUS LOVES EVERYBODY. don’t join a cult of self-righteous and wicked people. instead, be who you are. the gays are the truly persecuted ones throughout history. don’t let evil win. don’t let your darkness inside tell you that you need to be a different person to go to heaven. LOVE WILL ALWAYS OVERPOWER HATE. bless god and bless the gays †
Blake,
True loves never encourages a person to go down a path of self-destruction. This is evident in the gay community despite its attempts to paint a nice varnish. Christ loves everyone so he came to deal with the sin that is trapped in us from birth. We all sinners and it shows up in us in different ways including homosexuality. The reality is that majority of people rejected Christ when he first came and so now most will also rejected his offer of salvation from the power and penalty of sin. God loves you yes but sin is not your friend but a deceptive master will lead you to a path of pain, destruction and eternal separation from God himself.
True love never encourages a person to go down a path of self-destruction, that’s true! I think we all can agree with that.
That is evident in both the gay and straight communities. When people don’t seek love, and don’t seek to find a partner, they instead seek to just have “fun” with sex as many do – and that does lead to self-destruction often!
Christ loves everyone, and he came to help us deal with such lust, so that we can strive towards something higher, like true love – which doesn’t lead to self-destruction. Sinning shows up as lust in many, and many reject Christ and follow lust rather than hold out for love.
Love does not lean to pain, destruction and separation from God, but leads to happiness, prosperity, peace and being at one with God. I’m sorry Matt went down the path of lust before – many have, and many can be forgiven.
Matt I recommend you check out Centre for Spiritual Living! It will really help you with you challenges and give you grace and wholeness that you need whether you are gay or not!!! The God I know doesn’t make mistakes nor does he “hate” anyone!
Bless you!
It is through struggles that we come to know who reigns in our lives. It is through struggles that we realize that we see the need to go back to God. It is through struggles that we see the glory and grace that He shows us. Matt, always remember that the guilt-feeling that us Christians have is the prompting of the Holy Spirit to steer us away from sin. All of us struggle between good and evil. If we never struggle, I don’t think we’ll ever know what’s right and wrong. Our Lord Jesus is always by our side in such times. My prayer goes to you.
SO BEEN THERE AND DONE THAT!!!! I see a lot of encouragement for you on this page, Matt. And I’ll include mine. Even after 20 years, it’s still a struggle at times. You’ll have more triumphs that back slides. Just hang in there. It does get easier mainly because God’s grace just abounds more and more. And even when you totally screw up, He doesn’t give up. He’s still there waiting for you to come back. No worries, my brother!! You weren’t born perfect and you won’t die perfect either. When you feel that way again, though…reach out! Cuz we’re all here to help you get through it.
We love you Matt! Reject the hate and actions of those who want dissuade. Press into Hebrews 12:1: therefore since we are surrounded by such a great cloud of witnesses, let us throw off everything that hinders us and the sin that so easily entangles, and run with perseverance the race that is set before us!
Hallelujah!
I am stunned at all the people who use the word of God to jusitfy hatred toward any person on this planet. God loves all of us every single person in this Earth. We are all his children. It seems that people who quote the Bible forget the verse Judge not lest ye be judged. We are commanded by God to love everyone, not just people who believe what we believe or act the way we act or demand they act like us. This is not what love, what God tells us to do to one another, is about. HATE is not what God wants or demands of us.
Just not UNLESS you are ready to be judged by the same standards that you judge others by. Do you people who quote this famously misused verse EVER read the entire passage? Jesus NEVER said to NEVER judge. He said to judge carefully and with humility and to be innocent of all wrong-doing. He said to NOT IGNORE the log in our own eye…
Sir, loving people also does not mean that we simply accept the sinful behavior of others. It is CHRISTLIKE to address the sins of others and help them towards repentance. THAT, too, is loving. This has nothing to do with hate simply because we stand for the Biblical and God-sanctioned view of sexuality. The true hatred is to use limited portions of God’s Word to support a notion that is absolutely revolting to God – SIN. Or have you not read the Scriptures where God created them man and woman? Have you EVER read anything in Scripture where God completely sanctions homosexuality? Show me any of our Biblical heroes that are homosexual. Name just one couple.
You won’t find any. I will be so bold as to suggest that you are hating God’s Word to even promote the idea that God somehow is okay with homosexuality.
That seems to me to be the problem with people who think like you Michael. You worship the Bible, not God.That’s a form of idolatry and breaks Christ’s greatest commandment to all of us, “Love the Lord your God!”
Dude, you are in some serious denial. I feel a great deal of pity for you. I feel that you are a really cool guy. You’re attractive, appear to be relatively smart, and are clearly in need of some sort of relationship that affirms your true homosexual self.
YOU WILL NEVER find peace denying who you are. Never!
Matt, you are gay! Affirm this identity and move forward. Continuing to fight your self will inevitably lead toward self-destruction—it ALWAYS does!
I’ve been openly gay since I was 17 years old. I am not 34 years old and to date affirming my homosexuality was the BEST decision I have ever made.
For Christ to increase, I must decrease.
Yes, self-denial of sinful desires is paramount to finding peace.
Matt’s identity – who he is – is not found in his sexuality. His identity is found in Christ. Before you can accuse Matt of being in denial, you need to understand Jesus Christ.
It’s when Matt – or anyone – gives into their own whims and desires that inevitably lead to self-destruction. That’s the way it always happens.
Can you just tell me one thing… Why do you think that homosexuality is wrong? Christians are great at telling you that certain things are wrong, but never an actual reason as to WHY.
“‘cuz the Bible says so”, that’s their argument.
Jake and Harr,
The world has a bible and it is called feelings which change quickly on the latest fad and blinds us to our sin. Already some are entertaining the idea of condoning incest based on the same assumptions for feelings being the justification for defining sexuality as has been prescribed by some who hold to your views.
Good point. Some have feelings/urges to be with children, animals, threesomes, orgies.. etc etcetc. were they born that way?
As if God didn’t condone incest (Cain and her sister, Lot’s daughters, Abraham and Sara, etc.)
As if God didn’t condone incest (Cain and his sister, Lot’s daughters, Abraham and Sara, etc.)
More precisely,
because the Lord God JEHOVAH , who is Lord of Lords and King of Kings, who does as He pleaseth, whose might maketh right, says so.
If you disagree…well, remember that he has unfettered power to cast His enemies into a Lake of Fire, where they will be tormented day and night in the presence of the holy angels and the Lamb, the smoke of their torment arises forever and ever, and they shall have no rest day nor night. You can not stop Him from casting anyone into the Lake of Fire, nor rescue anyone from the Lake of Fire.
Jake,
How do you know it is right?
I know what’s right FOR ME.
I wasn’t able to reply to your comment just below, I guess because it is too far nested, so please forgive that this reply isn’t in quite the right place. But here’s something I hope you will take a little time to think about as to why your simple answers fall flat.
You dismiss all the (many) anomalies in the bible to what you believe to be the only type of sexual relationship sanctioned by God by pointing to Paul’s claim that God overlooked certain sin in the past. The problem with this simple solution is that it does not fit with the actual text of the Old Testament. I could give many examples from the OT where things we now consider wrong were not “overlooked” by God but actually sanctioned, ordered or aided by God. I will just mention a couple to make my point. God commanded the brother of any man who died without a son to take his dead brother’s wife and impregnate her so that his brother might have an heir. That was not a command to bachelors only and furthermore if the brother was as of yet unwed, he would still be expected to take a wife of his own besides so that he might have an heir as any son born to his dead brother’s wife would be considered his brother’s heir rather than his own. So, in your perfect little world where God merely overlooked the sin of polygamy rather than sanctioning it and making it thus not a sin, God commanded these men to sin. Since the very definition of sin is disobeying God, that isn’t really possible is it?
Second, in a passage in 2 Samuel where God is speaking to David through the prophet Samuel, God tells David that He (God) gave him (David) many wives. There is no logical way to conclude that God giving David many wives can be brushed off as God overlooking David’s sin of polygamy.
My third and final example (though I could easily keep going) is that Abraham married his half-sister Sarah. Now your answer to this one is of course not that God overlooked this sin but that the commandment against such is part of the mosaic law which had not yet been given. That is actually precisely why I picked that example. You see, you (and many others) like to present God has having an unchanging sexual ethic for human relationships from creation to the end of the world, from Genesis to Revelation so to speak. But here we have an example where Abraham was told to marry from amongst his own kin. He chose someone very closely related (his half-sister) and not only did God not mind that these two half-siblings married, but He (God) actually held their relationship to a status that no other was given (before or since) in that He said that through them all the nations of the Earth would be blessed. This despite the fact that He would later introduce a law that would forbid anyone at that time from marrying their half-sibling. This undeniably demonstrates that, while God may be unchanging, the laws He gives to govern human relationships are certainly not unchanging. God has shown himself able to adapt to the changing needs of the times, it’s unfortunate that many Christians cannot. In any event, whatever time period you want to package God up in and say that this rule or that rule can never change, you need to at least start being honest with yourselves about the shifting nature of those guidelines in the past, even if you want to claim that they have magically reached their ultimate destiny now and can never shift again. As long as fundamentalist Christians claim that the rules governing what is or isn’t an acceptable relationship in the eyes of God have been set in stone and never changed from the beginning of creation, you completely discredit yourselves with anybody that has actually read the bible in its entirety, or for that matter, anybody reasonably literate with access to the Internet and its great array of easily searchable bible websites.
Just something to think about…
this is taking an insane amount of time and i have to get off this internet for now, but let me say this, polygami was legal, but not homosexuality, and getting skincolor into the picture is way off, and NOT the same as gender. To try to defend gay marriage from a biblical perspective is to lie, so you may want to ask for forgiveness yourself (and no I didnt lie when I said LGBT movement said it was part of their agenda, they declared it as early as 1973). The Biblie prohibits homosexuality, in the levitical laws and its denounced in the NT. It is never condoned in any way shape or form. You can deal with that with God, but to deny it is to LIE.
And for those of us who don’t accept your interpretation of scripture? How about the ones who don’t believe in your god or accept the bible for being anything more than a book of fables and fairy tales? I guess we’ll just agree to disagree and carry on with our lives. That’s what I’ll be doing.
OOOO! Good question. The BIble says it, BUT, it never explains WHY????
It does tell us that sin in us due to the original fall. It is sin because it goes again the orginal design for sex that God has us. We naturally are born in sin so naturally we gravitate or struggle with sin in us . We just do it by instinct until we are confront with the truth which can set us free. We never need anyone to teach us to sin because it is in us and evil is a natural outcome too. Explain evil such as hate and murder then? Why do people commit these as instinct? God’s spirit has been holding the complete deprivation of humanity in our society but we are losing this at a rapid rate. It is getting worse and more callous because man without God will naturally regress to a self-destructive path often justified by feelings
God didn’t design us, we evolved. Learn biology and don’t rely on ancient myths.
The most important question is what the bible tell me to do now. It only condones one form of marriage and sexual relationship. Does the bible encourage me to do what you mentioned? Absolutely mot so your point is mute and not even an issue. God did overlook sins in the past as the Paul tells us but now now he has revealed to us the full truth so the real question is what we do with it because it will determine our eternal destiny whether in eternal separation or the greatest experience for eternity.
Our sexuality is deeply linked to our image of God.
A good book to read on this matter is “Sacred Sex” by Tim Allen Gardner. It doesn’t discuss the homosexuality issue, but the Biblical design for sex. It’s a POWERFUL book and easy to read (as in, easily accessible for a general audience).
If God made us according to his image, we would be bodyless, shapeless spirits without gender.
That argument has never made sense, so stop using it, Xtians
Matt, I used to be where you were. I was an up-and-comer in Exodus. I spent 7 years as a part of Living Hope Ministries. There was no way on God’s green Earth I could reconcile being gay and Christian. But that was then. We all have an interpretation of Scripture and when I finally realized that the fundamentalist/literalistic interpretation doesn’t jive with reality (in more ways than just sexuality) I found another way that I believe is more true to God. Now i’m married to a man who is in seminary to become a pastor. When I was in your shoes I wouldn’t have listened to someone like me. But you can just file this in the back of your mind somewhere for when you’re ready. Grace to you!
Hello Matt, I really enjoy reading about your constant battle against your own tendencies and I thank you for offering such a detailed and clear testimony. I remember it really helped me understand myself and even the way God works a little bit better, or at least how it all works for me. I used to suffer a great deal over these same issues. I remember having periods of most suffering and emotional turmoil and turning deeply to the Lord for help. Not so long ago, I tried insistently to break all contact with the gay world. I found myself feeling so alone and in dispair I couldn’t take it anymore, I think what happened was that I began to ask myself for something that was humanly impossible for me, I was almost going crazy, as I began to feel so religiously obsessed with the idea that almost anything I truly wanted was sinful and corrupt. I had forgotten two very important things about God and that is that He is forever loving and forgiving. I still believe deeply that a gay lifestyle is not the answer to my happiness nor it’s what God wants for me, but now I keep in mind that above all, God knows me better than I do, and understands me better than anyone else. Even if the Lord doesn’t approve, He will always be there to help me out as I try to live my life in the best way I humanly can. I believe He in all His grace and mercy understands that no one can live without love, affection or even sex. He surely knows that I’m flawed as He is almighty. I believe that the written word of God should be taken seriously but I shall always keep in mind that it was wrote by people who were inspired by God not by God himself. I say all this because now, even though I still feel guilty of the sinful things I do sometimes, I have also found a way to forgive myself and stop myself from going insane. Now at least I too enjoy from a certain free will that is completely severed when one devotes oneself to complying with all that is written in the word of God, in my opinion this is unhealthy and unnatural, as for me there is nothing more unnatural than not being able of being yourself, accepting your weakness. I still bare a cross as we all do, but not as heavy as the Lord’s. His achievement remains exemplary, divine and far from the reach of all mankind. The only thing that remains is to do things in the best way possible looking up to the Lord and to have faith that He himself in all his omnipotence shall save us from destruction. He would never ask us to be perfect, He would ask us to fight our imperfection and surpass our anxiety and fears, our jealousness and our hate towards others and our pitty for ourselves, to be strong like He is, and to be hopeful in Him.
Matt,
You are in my prayers and my hearts breaks over the fact that you have been struggling. I kept wanting to warn that you need get others from the body of Christ in your life who can know your struggles and hold you up in times that are difficult. We are not lone rangers. You have been much on my mind and I really do believe that we as believers in modern Christianity need to understand the importance of intimate Christian unity and looking out for each other. Christ intended us to be his body with him as the head to be more than just a organization. We need relationships with each other so God can do his healing work in us as we gather weekly or perhaps daily. We the church need to understand that God wanted his church to be more than a Sunday meeting but a community of believers who lookout for each other and allow the Holy Spirit to do his work in us thru us. Paul warn us in Colossians chapter three we will struggle with sin still in us but Paul tells us the following ” So put to death the sinful, earthly things lurking within you. Have nothing to do with sexual immorality, impurity, lust, and evil desires.” We need to make no room for that because sin is crouching for opportunity in us as it did with Cain who was warned about this by God himself. Sin is crouching at our the doors of lives. The world seeks to use this incident as indictment that gayness is a permanent and accepted identity in your life. The truth is that You are now a new creation in Christ and so the world will want drag you in their bondage. They will naturally hate us because the sin in them has put a hate for us and for the authentic Christ. I noticed that the so-called loving gay commentators enjoyed heaping abuse on you and this only shows their true colors. They want to you to fail because they constantly need to find someone or your fall to justify their sinful choice to be their own god. Matt, God has a plan for you and we have the truth. We cannot live by our feeling but the truth has stood the test of time. You have been forgiven by Christ. God is done with you but he will us this to draw you to God in a way as never more. He wants to do a deep work in you. Remember Peter betrayed Jesus but Christ used this to show him and us that we must never trust ourselves too much but only in Him who can give us great power to his will. Peter was restored and so God wants to do with you. Shut the doors that sin is using to crouch in. It is all our heart and allowing even a remote evil in there. Flee from anything that stirs lust in you because satan seeking to trip you or worse destroy your faith. He has much gain from your fall but God will use it to bring greater openness in us all because we need each other daily. We all have the same issue of sin in us no matter what it is and we need to prepare ourselves daily for the battle. We need to know our provision in Christ who is all we need and we need to learn how to put on the whole armor of God. We need to mediate and study daily the scriptures especially our new covenant so we will know to how fight our battle against darkness and its deceptive lies.
So many here who are for the gay lifestyle constantly refer to giving in because they could not stop the feelings of homosexual. They worship happiness more than God who can gives us never ending and deep joy and peace. Proponents of the gay lifestyle have a chosen a reality based on a myriad trap of feelings which blinds them to a Holy God. The reality is that none of us can stop completely stop the urges of sin in us until we see Christ and are endowed with a new and perfect body but we can shut off triggers and more importantly be filled with the Spirit who gives us a new desires for a new and better life. Satan is a liar who is angel of light promising enlightenment and false love. Sin always kill us and this is so evident in the gay lifestyle which has led many to tragic ends but this seems to be completely pushed aside as a concern.
I love you brother and I will be praying for you. Stand on truth even when it seems that it seems bleak. Seek Christ knowing that he loves you greatly. I am praying that you soon have a network of believers who love Christ greatly so they will make a great effort to meet you and love you also.
Hebrews 3:12-14 ” Be careful then, dear brothers and sisters. Make sure that your own hearts are not evil and unbelieving, turning you away from the living God. You must warn each other every day, while it is still “today,” so that none of you will be deceived by sin and hardened against God. For if we are faithful to the end, trusting God just as firmly as when we first believed, we will share in all that belongs to Christ
I am so bad at missing words constantly in my writing. God is not done with you but he has did with Peter will use this incident for a opportunity to teach you his ways. It is so true. because I have fallen but it has taught that human righteous is frail but Christ in us is able to do all things in us. Stand on truth tonight and rest in the love of Christ. He died for you and wants to a mighty work in you yet. I have to wake up each morning preparing my mind for battle and seeking to find my life in Christ. He is so awesome and his love is so incredible.
In all honesty Matthew, if you REALLY don’t want to lust for men ever again, consider castration.
Thinking about it, didn’t Jesus say something about living as a eunuch?
Why do ppl who promote homosexuality come to a blog of a Christian who does not believe that is right, and stands on what the Bible says on this, and try to tear him down instead of building him up in God’s WORD? Jesus said that not a word from the Law would pass away until the end. This is an issue that is not unclear. It is wholly denounced. It is certainly about as disheartening as it gets when “Christians” encourage other Christians to go against what the Bible teaches. God is talking to Matt, Matt feels in his HEART that this is not right, clearly, he is close to God. I guess I don’t know why you’re a Christian if you feel it is ok? You can pick another religion who befits what you believe instead, or make up your own. Keep the Faith Matt. I will be PRAYING for you.
Are you a Jew for Jesus?
I’m not Jewish, but Jesus was, and God’s name is Yahweh. Might be good for you to know.
Might be good for you to know Jesus couldn’t have possibly been the Jewish Messiah.
http://www.aish.com/jw/s/48892792.html
yes he was/is. what are you doing on a thread like this though?
Didn’t you read the link I posted?
The link is irrelevant, Harr. Jesus was born, lived, and died as a Jew. He came to the Jews as their Messiah and died “King of the Jews.” Where is your anti-biblical and anti-Christian “information” coming from?!
From Judaism itself.
It’s not my fault you’ve been deceived by Pauline Christianity
Harr,Jesus and all the early Christians were Jews. That’s slightly old news.. recorded in the NT that some didn’t. So what’s your point?And “Pauline Christianity”? Jesus was not a liberal hippie like you may want to think. If you actually read the Bible you might find out who he was.
Exactly, Jesus and his early followers were Jews; that’s why their religion differs so much from Paul’s. There was no such thing as the “Son of God”, the Trinity, the Virgin Birth, or any other pagan elements that Paul gave to Jesus to attract gentiles.
Different people are on here for different reasons.
Some who come on to tear him down do so because they fear he contributes to gay youth being unable to accept themselves, struggling, failing, and seeing no hope in life.
Some however come here with hope, not to promote homosexuality but to promote acceptance and loving yourself.
I understand that some believe it is not right, but some believe it is right. And people who have disagreements can share. I do not believe in going against what the Bible teaches, I believe in going with love that the Bible teaches, and a greater understanding.
I personaly understand that he now feels closer to God than when he was out looking for “fun.” If I were, I probably would not feel as close to God either. But I’m a Christian, and I feel love is God, and I don’t know why anyone would see it differently.
Good comment Alex. Agree. Also those who promote homosexuality and denounce the teachings about it as fundamenatlist bigotry, are not exactly loving. A house divided against itself cannot stand. Further, noonce here, and most, who affirms what the Bible teaches about this think that anyone the SSA can help what they feel. But feeling something, doesn’t mean you were created that way.
While I only see a few people really “promoting homosexuality,” and more just promoting accepting who you are,” there are quite a few who denounce certain beliefs about Scripture as fundamentalist bigotry. It can’t really be bigotry unless it’s used to regard members of a group as inferior, to regard gays as inferior and be intolerant of other opinions.
For most things, feeling something doesn’t mean you were created that way. For people with OSA and those with SSA, I do understand that they were created that way. All of us are either born with attractions to men, or attractions to women, or some both – and it’s up to us how we chose to live our life and how we choose to let those emotions guide us – towards lust, or towards love.
There are many on here who are not loving, on both sides, which disheartens me. There are many on here on both sides who are, which makes me proud.
Even Jesus was tempted by the Devil.
exactly.
fag.. you deny your own nature .. God gave you this gift and yet you still think your own sexuality is not okay. You need to know the difference between reality and fantasy. Stop immersing yourself in mythology and embrace who you are! A homosexual is what God intended for you to be! Denying who you really are so publicly just makes christians look even more stupid and hypocritical.
Sir, please read Genesis 1 & 2 and tell me what GOD – not you – decided our sexuality OUGHT to be.
And please tell me how this comment of yours (and the one following) promotes a loving and tolerant attitude that the gay community so frequently demands.
Then please identify for me the genuine hypocrites on this topic.
Matt knew what he would likely face when he came OUT that he was receiving Christ IN his heart. And yet you would bully him for holding to what God’s Word declares is holy regarding our sexuality?!
I do not know what God you think you serve, but it is not the God of Abraham, Isaac, or Jacob by your words. I cannot speak to whether or not you TRULY know Christ…but your WORDS and the attitude behind them are NOT of Christ.
Well spoken Michael Samuel Miller Jr
Genesis was never intended to be taken as literal truth. It’s just a creation myth, like every other culture’s. Even Jews know it.
Genesis isn’t a creation myth. It is biblical and scientific truth. Modern Jews may deny this but their ancestors didn’t! Genesis was never a myth in man’s eyes until modern times. That doesn’t make it right. They’ve just deceived themselves – and so have you.
” Genesis was never a myth in man’s eyes until modern times.”
Were you LOL’ing when you wrote that. Much of the stuff in the bible was believed until modern times. Once men became educated and were no longer desert-dwellers who thought a thunder storm was a sign that some god was upset with them, a lot of the myths and fables in the bible were understood for what they are – myths and fables. It’s shocking to me that in 2013 there are still people like you in the world. Many of you it seems.
Genesis 2:23-24 = God made them male and female and brought them to each other to marry, work together, live together, and have and rear children together. Genesis is the divine source of all godly sexual relationships, the marriage of one man and one woman for life. Anything other than this is sin. Those who deny it are sinful and deceived!
Lev 20:9 “Anyone who curses their father or mother is to be put to death. Because they have cursed their father or mother, their blood will be on their own head.”
Are we still following that one too?
This mentality that display, that being gay is a bad thing is the reason why gay kids kill themselves. You really are part of the problem and not the solution. The blood of children is on your hands and the hands of your christian brethren.
@Merk Hudson,
That’s right blame the Christians for gay teen suicide deaths. What an idiotic thing to say.
Absolutely no one bullies gay teens more than other homosexuals. Gay youth related deaths from HIV/AIDS far surpasses gay teen suicides.
And how many of these gay youth attempt [or are successful] at suicides once being told they have been infected with HIV/AIDS? Quite a difficult thing for any gay youth to hear.
How many of these gay teens commit suicide after being force out of the closet by other homosexuals?
And we can pretend gay on gay violence is not a huge problem within the LGBT community especially among lesbian couples.
How many homosexual and heterosexual youth are sexually abused, harassed, stalked, victims of infatuation by homosexuals?
When I was a teenager there was a student at a neighboring school district who committed suicide because of the constant sexual harassment by older homosexual males. Almost weekly this teen would face a litany of offered blow-jobs and homosexual fetishes until finally he couldn’t take it…so he jumped to his death.
The real shame in all of this is his father was gay and he knew what was going on and actually tolerated the perversions. It was his gay butt-buddies who was attempting to abuse his son. He was 17 years old.
By the way change your shirt makes you look fat.
I have not seen evidence that the mass suicide of gay youths is caused by bullying from gay peers. Most often it’s youth who don’t really have much of a support group, much less know that many other gay youth.
And you’re right that STDs are a problem, not just for gays but for straights.
I have not heard of many gay teen youth attemting suicide after being told they have contracted HIV – it would be unlikely at that point to have already developed AIDS.
And I have also not heard of teens committing suicide after being forced out of the closet by other gays. Do you have numbers of these?
Domestic violence is a problem within the straight community and the gay community – there is no need to pretend it doesn’t exist anywhere!
Most youth who are sexually abused are done so by parents and relatives, who identify as heterosexual. Instances of sexual abuse done by people who identify as gay is quite rare, as studies who have looked at sexual orientation of molesters have found.
And I’m not sure about the numbers on harassment, stalking and infatuation by homosexuals vs. heterosexuals… are you?
Wow, I feel sad for the pain for what that student must have felt, just as for all youth regardless of orientation who suffer, and whose parents are not supporting. I find it sad that you chose to use this once incidence to condemn all gays. What was the victim’s name?
I hope you can find peace within yourself. If you ever need to know of some churches in the New Orleans area that you can attend that will teach the message that God love everyone, and that sexuality is simply an innate characteristic, let me know. I can email you a list of a few, as well as some in the surrounding areas if you feel you might feel safer looking at that community outside of New Orleans. You’re not a sinner Matt. You’ve just been taught to hate yourself. I hope you can learn to love yourself the way you are. I’m sure God does.
Where in Scripture are we taught that our sexuality is innate and that we are not sinners?
Where in Scripture does Jesus once address homosexuality?
Mt 15:19, Mk 7:21. Do you know the Greek word “porneia”? Pornography comes from it, and it refers to sexual immorality, i.e anything outside of the marriage covenant. So, yes, Jesus directly spoke against it. Did you read Mt 5:32, 19:3-9. Did you read the Law in Leviticus 18:22? Did you read what Jesus said about the Law? Read Mt 5:17, for example. There are more passages than these. If you don’t want to adhere, that’s your choice, but don’t come here and say this wasn’t part of ancient Israelite law and beliefs, including those of Jesus.
Here are words from a pastor reaching out to gays.
Silence is Golden but there’s a time to speak,
And there are those shouting their views, but their arguments are weak
Let me get this out there and make it simple and plain
I never knew of anyone who found freedom from a hate speech in Jesus name
Reckless pastors, who judge, condemn and leave a soul to feel alone
Called to shepherd God’s people, not cast the first stone
And other leaders do no favors by cowardly choosing silence
They fail to speak the truth, and offer no guidance
A culture full of tension over the issue so where does that leave us?
Somewhere between awkward silence and gay bashing in the name of Jesus
And in the middle stands truth, a truth that can set us free
A God that calls us out of darkness to embrace our true identity
In a culture that glorifies sex and puts pleasure before all else
Is God the source of your identity or is it your sexual self?
And how do we identify and not accept a lie
Because sexual desire is just one piece of the pie
Identity is a choice a lifestyle is something you embrace
Same sex Attraction doesn’t define you and can be set in place.
A movement with semantics aimed to change and sway
There needs to be clarification when using the word gay
Does it mean one has attractions or that they choose to act them out?
Truth says there is a difference in the two that must be brought about
God loves you the way you are and the truth can set you free
There is a difference between unchosen sexual attraction and chosen identity
In marriage two become one flesh, open to life for propagation
Two of the same in union can’t reach this fulfillment of God’s creation
Nature or Nurture you didn’t choose this struggle
The Church understands and will walk with you in times of trouble
The same Church that says no when we fail to keep our sexual selves in check
Is the same Church that says no when others try to take your respect
You never are alone and the Church offers you a home as it stand for what is true.
Although the Church says no to gay marriage it still says Yes to you.
Fr. Claude (Dusty) Burns
Aka Pontifex
8/13/12
A Spirit Juice Studios Production
© 2012 Spirit Juice Films. All Rights Reserved.
Matt, what else can be said? I would have been deeply disappointed if you had given up Christ, but Christian or not, the obvious fact is that we’re all still struggling with sin, even when we’re deeply in a relationship with our Lord and Friend, Jesus.
But it’s refreshing to know you have not given up on Jesus and that you are allowing Him to humble you.
So if Christ has forgiven you – and certainly He has – then, sir, so do I. (Though I do not feel you have personally offended me in ANY way. Just know that I will not hold this against you…random stranger and fellow brother in Christ that I am.)
I will defend you if ever this matter comes up from the critics and nay-sayers. I hope that alone offers a little encouragement. You just let God deal with your heart. We’ll get your back on this end.
I hope you feel at peace in the meantime.
Oh, and Matt, I know you’ve said in your post things about what Jesus said about homosexuality. And I’m sure your pastor has told you things about what Jesus said about homosexuality. So I would challenge you to do this—read the Bible for yourself, and look for any mention that Jesus made about homosexuality. I guarantee you that Jesus never once spoke on this.
Don’t you think that if it was such a great sin, he would have? Or that God might have chosen to put it in the commandments?
In any case, I do understand that there are some passages that don’t sound particularly favorable to homosexuality in the Bible. But I also know that there are passages that address how slaves should be taken and treated in order to please God. Surely, you don’t believe that slavery is ordained? Do you? If their could be rules in the Bible about taking slaves, surely there could be other passages that are somehow wrong, couldn’t there?
Again, I hope you find peace.
Remember when Jesus was questioned about divorce? He didn’t argue about when divorce was or was not okay. He went straight back to the Original Design: One man, one woman. ONE FLESH.
So whether Jesus was questioned about divorce, homosexuality, incest (after God specifically said no more of that), bestiality…if it does not align with God’s design as found in Genesis 1 & 2, it’s wrong. Period.
Also, the slavery frequently mentioned is that of bond servants. Those who “sell” themselves into servitude in order to pay off debts. After a period of 7 years, they were to be set free. And even slaves capture in war time were to be treated WELL, fully taken care of. You confuse the abuse of slaves of other cultures (sadly, including America) with the type of slavery God sanctioned.
I’m not confused about slavery in the Bible. You are. You can’t read the modern translations where “slave” has been mistranslated to “servant” as a way to make the idea more appealling and think that changes what the original word meant: slave. I imagine you’ve been told a lot about what’s in the Bible and done very little reading of it yourself.
Initially when I saw the story on Huff Post, I thought “of course that ex-gay evangelist is on grindr.” But reading this blog post just made me sad. I really hope Matt will be able to reconcile his faith with how God made him. Sexual orientation can’t be changed, and attempts to change behavior can be devastating by making you feel isolated and alone. The only thing Matt has to choose from here is to keep or abandon his faith.
You’re not alone, Matt! You can be who you are AND a good Christian. A homosexual sexual orientation is NOT a sin, and there is a community waiting for you.
God bless.
Rick
Rick, your post is well intentioned, but this isn’t a choice between choosing to be gay or to keep his faith. He can easily have both, his true self and his faith. And when he realizes that truth, he will truly be free, and he will thrive!
Well said, Gabriel! But I would not simply say it’s easy to have both. Many face struggles, and due to their own views of faith, it’s a long road to accepting that they can have both.
When you deny yourself, you deny God. “So God created man in his own image…” There is absolutely no religious reason to suggest you shouldn’t be listening to your body and your instincts. These people who have tried to convince you otherwise are neither followers of nature, nor of the Bible.
This was heartbreaking to read especially to see you destroy yourself over nothing. As a straight women I know that God made me and you just the way we are suppose to be, me as a straight women and you as a homosexual man. That you would think that God would give you a desire to love others and not act on it is such a shame and an example of man’s will not Our Lord’s will. Sad that rather than make peace with what God wants for you, you must constantly be trying to be something men who have fear of homosexuals have told you to be. At the very least if you truly are following the bible learn to read the original texts and talk a true person of god not your pastor who is clearly imposing his will and not divine. I’ll pray that you see God’s will for you to be a homosexual in a loving and supportive relationship with another homosexual man and stop harming your soul and perverting God’s will be denying your nature. I’ve met many homosexual men and ladies who have true relationship with our Lord and their good deeds are truly the will of God rather than the arrogance of the priests in the temple.
oh how ridiculous.
Do you check your garments to see if there is wool mixed together with linen? do you drive your car on Saturday or turn on a lightbulb on Friday night? If you do, you are guilty of a major sin and deserve to be stoned. How about a blt? or worse–a cheeseburger! Good lord–that’s a double sin and you should be drawn and quartered.
Did your butcher check his knife before he slaughtered the cow and was it killed with one swift slice to the neck? Was the meat salted?
If you marry–will your wife go to the mikveh and will you respect the law of purity of the family? Do you even know what this means?
Did a gentile touch your wine? If so, it’s considered idol worship to drink it.
If you are quoting one part of the law then recognize it all.
If you claim that Jesus allowed disregarding any of the above laws–where did he say it?
If you claim that he opposed homosexuality–where did he even mention it once?
The law is the law. You’re right to be off of Grindr, but if you have a bit of leavening on Passover, then you’re just as guilty.
You just don’t want to be ostracized because you got caught cruising. You’re gay. You like cock. Get over it.
Hey brotha…been thinking about your post and reading what people are writing. Two things jump out: 1) God is using you to make a difference on impacting the debate on homosexuality and 2) the posts really show how much you are loved and cared for. You must definitely are gonna come out of this a stronger and happier man. Keep swingin my brotha and God Bless. Andy
Dear Matt, you were on Grindr. It does not matter, because YOU ARE GAY. And it is not wrong. I hope you will finally admit it and have a happy life… with your homosexuality. Un saludo.
Homosexuality is wrong, when two homos can bring forth life the way God intended with man and woman, then get back to me, until then I know you’re wrong, Matt knows your wrong and most inmportant God knows you’re wrong.
You do realize that there’s 6.4 BILLION people on the world right?? We’re not really in any danger of dying out even if 50% of the population randomly decided to turn gay which is very unlikely.
Learn how to spell, form a plausible argument and not use the word “homos” (a la the Westboro Baptist Church) and we’ll talk. Until then…
The problem is that you are treating the issue like it’s an addiction. That’s not what an orientation is. All research supports the fact that a person’s sexual attractions are not willfully changeable, and attempting to do so only leads to mental distress. Just because you have same sex attractions….doesn’t mean you have to be promiscuous. Simply because your sexual attractions aren’t controllable…..doesn’t mean you can’t control your sexual behavior. Behavior is not attraction. And that won’t equate altering your attractions. You are merely torturing yourself due to self hate. Even if you remained celibate, that won’t affect your attractions. Both homosexuality and bisexuality occur naturally in nature, recorded amongst many species in the animal kingdom. Its a natural occurrence. It isn’t isolated to humans. There appear to be a clash between observable evidence, and religious claims that contradict natural observations, homosexuality is simply one of many where reality does not back religious assertion. If such claims are all you’re using to justify your view of homosexuality…then it’s time to face reality and start looking at the evidence.
just suck a cock already
Go back to Pakistan already
Abba Father, in Jesus name bring for great victory in Matt’s life. Have great mercy on him and empower him through the Holy Spirit to live the life You have called him to live. With no turning back. For it is by Your Grace and Mercy that he has seen his sin and desires to repent. Open his eyes to see the enemy every time he is tempted laughing at him. Open his eyes to see the tears of Jesus every time he is tempted. Open his eyes to see the arms of Jesus open wide to welcome him into to his arms. Jesus, You are the Man who truly loves Matt and will never leave him or cast him away. You are his hope and his salvation, his safe place. In Jesus Name hold Matt close and surround him with Your angels ..May Matt always bring You glory and never harm…..I thank You for Matt and for the call on his life…..All for You, Jesus, all for You I ask for Matt….
Matt, have you every ask Jesus to baptize You with the Holy Spirit’s power like he did in Act. He did that for me and this power helps You to live what He is asking of you….
________________________________
Amen! We need spiritual anointing to live holy lives. That anointing comes only through total surrender. [Thank you for writing this beautiful prayer.
]
Perhaps you’re depressed because you are suppressing your sexuality over a belief in an entity called god when there is not a shred of evidence for his existence! The bible is just a load of nonsense written by some random people 2000 years ago. If I wrote a load of bullshit down in a book, does that mean in 2000 years time people should believe everything I wrote in that book?! And have you stopped for a moment to wonder who/what created god? What’s more likely to have happened during the creation of the universe: nothing creating rather simple sub atomic particles during the big bang, or nothing creating an incredibly complex brain – god? It is a lot harder to go from nothing to a structure as complicated as god’s brain must be, than from nothing to the simple structure of the early universe – subatomic particles.
So considering you have no proof that god exists, never alone any proof that the bible is nothing more than some idiotic nonsense written down 2000 years ago, why do you think there is a man living in the sky making you attracted to men but will burn you for eternity if you actually have sex with them.
Use your brain just for one moment, and realise you’re waisting your life believing in a load of nonsense.
If you were born on the other side of the world and brought up by a different religion, would you believe in what you believe now? No of course not.
Matt can you believe this response? In just 24 hours you have received nearly 20,000 words in comments about being on Grindr!?!?!? Mind Boggling to say the least my friend. Utter disbelief in myself also for spending 2 hours parsing through elequent words and diatribes based on your need to feel shameful for a decision u made that only God will judge you for. “There will be peace in the valley for me”. Bless your heart…
It’s a battle for Matt’s soul, that’s all, the devils want it, but too late Matt has already been there, done that and he wants out, and now he can see the darkness that he used to be a part of lashing out in disgust at his desire to leave the darkness of hell and come home into the lightness of the Lord.
He wants out of the darkness of sleeping with random people, and he wants out of the darkness of depression of supressing his orientation.
The way out is for him to find, and might not be as easy for him to find as it seems.
The devil? Please? Are you for real? No wonder he’s such a mess. He’s gay and he’s being told by the likes of you that “god” hates his “sin!!” God hates your sinful pride. He says it’s an ABOMINATION.
You just need to except who you really are deep down in side. There is nothing wrong with being gay and you don’t lead any less of a “normal” (normal is a setting on the dryer) life. Stop trying to pretend to be something you’re not and just be who you are. Anyone that shouts “God hates Fags” obviously has never really red the bible. Stop reading between the lines and stop spreading hate. If you take the bible for what it really is, a book of stories. Treat others the way you want to be treated and stop spreading hate. Stop brainwashing people who are Gay/Lesbian to believing there is something wrong with them, there is nothing wrong with you!!
Dear Matt, if you get a chance to read this – I’ve been following your blog for a while now and I want you to know that, in my own muddled experience and striving for faith, you’ve been an encouragement (and still are)… it’s your sorrows and misgivings, your trials and errors that have pointed me to Christ’s faithfulness. I’ve seen there’s hatred and slander weighing heavy (AND wolves in sheep’s clothing, mind you), but I’m praying that you will use them as stepping stones to cling tighter to Jesus… Do not fear being a stumbling block to many, God never lets anyone go to hell by mistake and he’s appointed a time for everything; a time to break down and a time to build up. His ways are unsearchable especially in how He works them out for His glory! Remember that His judgement is kindness to those who love Him and it may be that “we are chastened, and yet not killed”. A quote by J.I. Packer says that “Your faith will not fail while God sustains it; you are not strong enough to fall away while God is resolved to hold you.” I’m glad for your decision to press on. Don’t lose faith over the attack of men and evil, but instead put on the armour of God. Endure and persevere to the end because that’s when true faith stands the test and wins victory! You know what’s amazing is that the whole Bible is a journey, with very few arrivals…so then we trust in the Lord, the author and finisher of our faith! Be blessed!
2 Corinthians 6
1 We then, as workers together with Him also plead with you not to receive the grace of God in vain. 2 For He says:
“In an acceptable time I have heard you,
And in the day of salvation I have helped you.”
Behold, now is the accepted time; behold, now is the day of salvation.
3 We give no offense in anything, that our ministry may not be blamed. 4 But in all things we commend ourselves as ministers of God: in much patience, in tribulations, in needs, in distresses, 5 in stripes, in imprisonments, in tumults, in labors, in sleeplessness, in fastings; 6 by purity, by knowledge, by longsuffering, by kindness, by the Holy Spirit, by sincere love, 7 by the word of truth, by the power of God, by the armor of righteousness on the right hand and on the left, 8 by honor and dishonor, by evil report and good report; as deceivers, and yet true; 9 as unknown, and yet well known; as dying, and behold we live; as chastened, and yet not killed; 10 as sorrowful, yet always rejoicing; as poor, yet making many rich; as having nothing, and yet possessing all things.
I I agree wholeheartedly with Ioana,
You are heavy on my heart Matt and even though we have never met it is because we are Christians we are tied together by the Holy Spirit and we all suffer with you. There is no question that no one wants to go down the road you are walking but we all have stumbled in this way just not in the public forum.
It is un-natural to take on the righteousness of God. It is much more comfortable to go back to sin. We are sometimes resentful of this calling because we are fish out of water flopping around in a sinful world dying a last breath until Jesus throws us back in the water.
The lesson is to stay immersed in Holy Spirit and the word.
May God use your disobedience to show His perfect love so that none will have an excuse that the Lords arm is too short to save . God’s mercy and love is perfect and it is only those who totally reject Him that He cannot save. But God wants to save them !
I know what it is like to get out of the kitchen when it gets too hot but don’t leave the house. We must proclaim the gospel to a fallen world to call out the warning to the lost and wretched. We must proclaim the truth to the disobedient mob if only to save one or two!
God will save sinners, the sacrifice of Jesus cries out to save souls not destroy them, “forgive them Father for they know not what they do. And grace will abound in us through our weakness.
“You are heavy on my heart Matt and even though we have never met it is because we are Christians we are tied together by the Holy Spirit and we all suffer with you. There is no question that no one wants to go down the road you are walking but we all have stumbled in this way just not in the public forum.”
Amen. I’ve been praying for you since Tuesday. I realized last night that our souls are knit together by the Spirit. I loved you instantly when I found your blog and Facebook page. I can say that of just one other person I’ve met in my 33 years. He’s a worship leader at my church. This is phileo love, a binding covenant of friendship founded on mutual faith in Jesus. God binds (knits) souls together in love – agape, phileo, and eros.
I’m going to piece all of your comments into a play and take it on the road. It’ll be a cautionary tale of how some religious cults can mess you up so much that you can write things like, “I loved you instantly when I found your blog and Facebook page. I can say that of just one other person I’ve met in my 33 years.” If that’s true that’s very, very sad. Don’t let your friends at bible study know that. They might not understand. I get it though. Matt is cute. Deranged and delusional, but cute as a button.
Yahoo! Voices rejects lily’s submisison:
“Thank you for your submission, but this is better suited to a personal blog than to our platform. Commentary published through Yahoo! Contributor Network should be thoughtful and measured, should make clear distinctions between opinion and fact, and should cite sources when appropriate.”
Hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha! Imagine the audacity of them wanting your reply to be” thoughtful and measured,” as opposed to some anti-gay opinion piece with a few bible verses thrown in.
@ostracario = what dirty, sinful rock did you crawl out from under? I think you need to go back! You have a dark, sinful heart and speak dark, sinful things. Your words are lies from the devil. He is your father and unless you repent you’ll end up where he is – eternity in hell.
You poor, demented soul. The devil is my father? Admittedly, my father is no saint but the devil? Hardly. You have no problem doling out the advice and praising those who agree with your deluded childishness but when you get called out on it, they’re “dark” and “sinful.” Read a few extra pages in your bible tonight, take a xanax, and you’ll be fine.
Something else. I never said Matt was cute, even if he is. I don’t see him that way at all. My love for Matt isn’t remotely sexual. Phileo = friendship. It’s not sexual attraction. You don’t know the Holy Spirit who binds people’s heart and souls together. You don’t know the spirit of unity among the true church. All you know is the demonic spirit of darkness.
“All you know is the demonic spirit of darkness.”
I’m actually sitting on a beach with sand in my toes and the sun shining down on my. It’s not dark at all. Although thinking about the inner-workings of your mind…that’s dark.
Btw, in denying you think Matt is cute so ferociously is proof that you’ve got it bad for him. Typical. Girls always fall for the gay boys. He is cute. Nothing to be ashamed of. But you don’t have what he likes…if you know what i mean.
You’re so wrong. I’m going to believe and pray that God won’t do things by halves in Matt’s life – that like Dennis Jernigan he’ll get married and have lots of children. God wants a wife and children for Matt, just like he wants for him a repentant heart and holy life. [And whoever Matt marries, it won't be me.]
If Matt does marry a woman he’ll destroy her life as well as his. I’ve seen it countless times. Look at Ted Haggard! Not only did he do what he did, now his wife and children are forced to lie for him. They’re not complacent in his sin. They’re all going to hell!!
Dennis Jernigan didn’t destroy his life or his wife’s. He’s been happily married for 20 years now, with nearly 10 children. You know nothing so shut up.
Proof that you’ve lost the argument? Your last resort is tell the other person to “shut up.” Nice comeback.
You provide one example of an “ex-gay” who’s managed to get married and not destroy the woman’s life or the lives of his children (a la Ted Haggard), and I could give you countless more who’ve had the exact opposite. I’ve sat with them and held their hands. I’ve listened to the women cry their hearts out at how they’d been deceived. Thanks for the “shut up” remark. It made me laugh so hard that everyone around me asked me what was going on. Now we’re reading your previous comments. Everyone’s having a gay old time.
Maybe shut up was lame. But the gays you’re talking about weren’t converted to Jesus. They weren’t cleansed of sin or supernaturally born again. Of course they and their wives ended up miserable. That doesn’t change what I said! God’s revealed will for everyone is to marry and have children. Only a few don’t.
Shut up was lame but we all have those moments of frustration. I beg to differ. The gay men of whom I speak were born again christians. It’s upsetting to me to when you and others like you say things like “oh but they weren’t real christians…they “weren’t cleansed of sin or supernaturally born again.” How do you know? Only god can know what’s in a man’s heart. That’s what I’ve been told anyone by my devoutly religious, born-again evangelical relatives. All of whom love and accept me btw. Both me and my husband. Please don’t blow a gasket and tell me that THEY can’t be true chrisitans because they don’t call us abominations. We’ve come so far today. I think we actually might have reached a point where we can agree to disagree and move on. Maybe..
Matt needs to be drenched in the anointing of the Holy Spirit. He needs to surrender all of himself to Jesus. Only then will he walk in true holiness. It takes God to worship and love and obey God as God. Anointing is the key.
And why am I casting the pearls of God’s Word before swine such as you?!
Matt’s in New Orleans. He’ll be drenched in glitter before anything else.
it’s all so contrived isn’t it? a mockery of words and scenes and characters, oh that the day was won and the curtains drawn on such foolishness. A serious word casts no shadows yet words are only avenues to the mind and heart Though the mind and heart cannot be truly expressed in words. And God sees through it all
amen
I have never had true lasting happiness or joy when I was seeking it for myself. The only joy I have ever truly experienced is when I was truly focused on others and Christ. The reality of this is, we think about ourselves every moment of everyday and it is literally a battle that satan uses against us as well. Every person I have ever met who was living in sin, was not truly happy. They might confess they were, but in honest moments there was no fruit of this and only despair. I pray that you will fight the good fight and not let moments of weakness make you give up what God is doing in and through your life. You show everyone that we all stumble, but you also show that you persevere and that my friend is worth more than any amount of riches!
So if you’re gay, seeking sexual and/or romantic relationships is selfish. If your straight, it’s not? How absurd.
Well said.
Buggery is a sin.
Dude, you’re gay, get over it. God made you that way, he doesn’t care.
God makes no one gay, read the Bible, God made Adam and then Eve as his wife, not Steve.
That’s all you’ve got…Adam & Eve not Adam & Steve? What grade are you in?
So in other words: “I’m an insatiable cock whore (and will continue to be) but unlike you, I repent and ask for the Lord’s love and forgiveness…every day…sometimes twice…once during Southern Decadence I had to ask for it four times in one night…but anyhoo…the rest of you homosexuals are unrepentant sinners who are destroying society and will burn in eternal hellfire. Also, lookin’ to play tonight, hit me up.”
Matt,
Thanks for being honest – I pray you find the support, care, and grace that you need to follow Christ move closely. Just think how much He loves you that he let you be found out! Weird, but it is a grace that helped keep you from more damaging decisions.
Peace be with you, brother.
You’re a crock. You can’t just wake up one day and decide not to be gay. If you weren’t BORN gay then you weren’t. If are, you are. This “god” stuff needs to stop, Matt. Just admit you were looking for a boyfriend and a husband and move on.
I agree that the Grace of God was with you. BUT Grace And TRUTH says: Call the Wambulance! I get so sick of hearing this whiny stuff about how much “Gay Christians” have to suffer through this life! We all suffer! I read your book and I empathized with you on that, but you are so stuck on that, it got old hearing it, if felt like isolation to me, not REDEMPTION.
Make a choice! Draw a line in the sand and step over it. Do you think you are the only one who gets tempted by the flesh, by our human condition?? We all get enticed, I do, you do, every single day we fight the fight of faith. At the point of our greatest weakness the enemy comes to entice us. You have to decide whether you are going to give God a completely or NOT. Because you and I we don’t sin alone, the consequences of your sin muddies our name Christian! What you did hurts me too, it is like I sinned too. Because your sin affects all of us, you don’t sin alone.
If you are going to STAND OUT, then STAND, Therefore in the strength of God with the family of God. Stop isolating yourself from us by saying you are a “Gay Christian” so we are not going to suffer like you do! WE are CHRISTIANS, we will suffer, that is all there is to it, just like Jesus did. Make your choice. If you can’t do that, then get out of the public limelight for a while and soak in the SONlight until you can.
Make the right choice the 1st time! Yes, God forgets and does not remember your sin, but the point is people do! I don’t go around telling people I am a “Straight Christian”! I am a CHRISTIAN and so are you. I get tempted in so many ways, enticed by the enemy and so do you. Sin is sin, no matter what the description you put in front of it. But Christianity is Christianity and it needs no description! Christ is your enough! Drop the Gay Christian thing… it isn’t working!! You ARE a CHRISTIAN and that is what sets you apart. You have been redeemed! I am sorry this seems harsh, I usually am not this way, but I sense God wanted to say that to you.
I have the gift of exhortation and God is using me to speak to you. He wants a “completely” like Psalm 86:11 says, Completely CHRISTIAN, undivided heart! He wants you to be called to HIM 1st, not your personal “agendas” to help Gay people. To God 1st! Vital-Vertical Relationship 1st and then out of that followship of HIM. You can’t change people as much as you can’t change yourself. You have to fall in love with God so much that you drown in His love, you die to yourself. You have to want to serve HIS Kingdom so much that the world means nothing to you and there is not cultural agenda that takes the place of the Kingdom of God. You cut all ties to “earthly viewpoints” and you cry out for a “Kingdom Perspective”!
You and I, we are CHRISTIANS, we are in “followship” of Jesus. This world serves us up all kinds of cultural crap, but we chose Christ, WE chose Christ because of our love for HIM and our future KINGDOM.
Whether people believe or reject, spin or rationalize God’s Truth does not change that it is TRUTH!!! You don’t have to prove it, God proves it, you need to live it because you love HIM! Stop trying to prove you can be a “Gay Christian” Just Be God’s be His Christian, a part of His Kingdom.
You think because you are “enticed” by the gay lifestyle that you are the only CHRISTIAN who suffers? Believe me Jesus suffered, He put the sacrifice in our salvation and He did it lovingly, humbly and meekly so that we could be free to put the sacrifice in our salvation. We all suffer this is a “fallen world”, we all have things we want to chase after, feelings we should not have!
Brother, get a grip on the reality of being God’s. He told us we would have tribulation in this world, but HE also said He overcame it for us. He overcame our habitual sin and gave us freedom from the chains of it. So cling to HIM, dig your roots deeply into His Kingdom and be, be, be Wholly-HOLY-HIS, be a CHRISTIAN! Stop isolating yourself from The Kingdom of God by calling yourself a Gay Christian, there are no GAY Christians in the Kingdom of God, there are CHRISTIANS in the Kingdom of God and YOU are one and so am I.
I could call myself a “Suicidal Christian” and Alcoholic Christian, a Depressed Christian. These are things that I am weak in, that entice me, that I fight the good fight of faith in. I call myself CHRISTIAN. I am not isolated from you because I suffer differently, Jesus suffered differently from us, but we EMBRACE Him, we are not isolated from Him because we suffer different things.
There is no other name higher. Jesus is enough, His name is enough, we wear His Name! You have to stop chasing after what you have “lost” becoming a Christian, turn and fully face God, and realize what You have been given. I lost alcohol, but if I thought about what I lost more than I did what I gained than I would be a drunk. I think about and treasure more what I was given than what I lost in following Christ. Are you out of balance there?
You have been given a King’s Love and you have been given a Kingdom, so stop chasing after a lost lifestyle, lost pleasures that you “feel” you can’t have, when you have been given the greatest love the world will EVER know or experience, a love so deep, so wide that we will never be able to take it in. Be Wholly-HOLY-God’s… not a Gay Christian, a Straight Christian, A Drug Free Christian, An Alcoholic Christian… BE A Christian 1st be called to God 1st! Because then your title is the same as ours you are not isolating yourself from us, thinking you are different, we all suffer, we all have pain, we all are enticed but we don’t chase after that which is dead, we turn to God Who wrote eternity on our hearts, and we stop chasing death and take what He has given us. Stop chasing what you have lost and receive the Kingdom GOD is offering because being Wholly-Holy A Christian, It Feels Like No Other Thing You Could Possibly Desire Feels Like, It Feels Like THIS:
http://youtu.be/1Qwyot158wM
It Feels Like Redemption
“I’m suffering!” said the white, Christian, heterosexual male. Have you ever heard of “white privilege”? Or “straight privilege”? Here in America, you can add “Christian privilege” to that list. You are so clueless. As a straight, white, Christian male, you live a life of unprecedented privilege and luxury. You live in a society whose laws, customs, hell, even PAID HOLIDAYS, are tailored to your lifestyle.
I could go on and on and on about how blind you are to the reality of life in America, but it is clear to me you will not listen. I am not subscribing to comments, go ahead and say whatever you want–I won’t hear it. Go ahead and have the last word and go on believing that you, as a straight white Christian male, can possibly even BEGIN to fathom the trials suffered by minorities in America. Just do me this one favor–look up how poverty affects African Americans versus how it affects whites. And BTW, I’m white–I just have the good sense to acknowledge the realities of privilege in our society. One other favor, actually–please at least TRY to be aware of how offensive you sound.
@ Ross. Why shouldn’t heterosexuals recieve special privileges from the government? We live in a straight country, a straight planet, a straight universe. The very survival of our species is totally dependent on hetersexuals. The universe since the beginning was and always be heterosexual affirming. Everyone including homsexuals bodies were created for the opposite sex…you do have reproductive organs don’t you? Homosexual coupes are inherently sterile therefore inherently inferior to marriage…not even in the same ball park. So I ask you why should homosexual couples be given the same protections and privilegous of marriage and family? Their relationship contributes nothing to society nor the to survival of our species.
Look around you absolutely everything is straight.
Loneliness is absolutely a huge issue for gay Christians. It is not good for us to be alone indeed. However random hook-ups with anonymous men will certainly not help with this issue, even a little bit. It will only make you feel more lonely. Curious, have you heard of/read the book, “Torn” by Justin Lee? I’m sure you would disagree with many parts of it, but it still offers a perspective I think you would find familiar. It is times like this that such perspectives are important to seek out, especially when we live in a world full of people whose struggles are so unlike our own.
Matt, stop hating yourself….Scientific and medical studies show that gay people are born the way they are. Be who you are meant to be, not what a your family, a church, a pastor or a ancient book (and incredibly inaccurate book, at that) says you should be.
No, it has NOT. there are NO scientific evidence, and there are in fact lots of ppl who have changed. This does not minimize the struggle of ppl like Matt, and surely, none of us have all the answers, but it is NOT scientifically proven you are born gay.
There are lots of people who have chosen to ignore their sexual orientation, like Matt, but they have not changed. There is no evidence of people who have changed orientation, who went from not liking the opposite sex and liking the same sex, to losing their same sex attraction and gaining an opposite sex attraction.
There is plenty of scientific evidence that epigenetic factors and womb environment play a role in sexual orientation, though not conclusive.
I haven’t found a scientific study yet that proves we are born gay in fact the last comprehensive genetic study failed to isolate a gay gene. It’s in the theoretical stage much like the theory of evolution, nothing proven, but oh, we are so close to finding that missing link. All we have to do is live a million years and we will have the proof we need. So many theories. There is no missing link, no evidence of macroevolution (species changing to another species) scientists say that microevolution (although they think they have found it in fossils but can’t say 100%) the process is so slow that we would never see it because our civilization probably won’t last 100,000 years.
Scientists and researchers say logic tells us it must be true. Proponents of the gay gene theory are hoping science will prove them right but at this point the last genetic researchers think there is no single gay gene but there maybe a combination of genes involved.
I guess they will be finding genes and combination of genes for all sorts of sexual persuasions then we can all safely categorize ourselves for future reference.
What’s your point Kathy? There’s no scientific proof that god exists either. Science has proven that the earth is a lot older than we’re let to believe in the bible thought. Curious.
As I said, it’s not conclusive, and in science we cannot prove anything – we can only draw theories to explain the evidence as best we can. Like the theory of gravity, or the theory of relativity.
There doesn’t seem to be any one gay gene, though studies have found genetics found on the X chromosome may be a factor in increased femininity, which in females would increase fertility, and in males increase effeminate features and traits.
Scientists and researchers say logic is used to explain what we observe, not tell us what must be true. It seems there is no gay gene, but epiginetic factors and the womb environment are what influences sexual orientation. And this is all more for males than for females. This evidence is shown in identical twin studies, fraternal twin studies, studies on men with several older brothers, as well as looking at androgen levels and manipulating androgen in laboratory mice.
So far, we have only found genes that may influence what sexual orientation one may have, not for any other persuasions relating to sex.
@ Alex you said It seems there is no gay gene, but epiginetic factors and the womb environment are what influences sexual orientation’
Once again Epigencis is a theory only and I find it interesting that womb developement is considered; and that the womb is defined as an enviroment for a growing human life.
Right, the epigenetics theory is just a theroy. As I said for the third time now, it’s not conclusive, and in science we cannot prove anything – we can only draw theories to explain the evidence as best we can. Like the theory of gravity, or the theory of relativity.
And the research into the womb environment I find very fascinating, as during 9 months when the brain and body grow immensely, the womb environment is providing nutrients and influencing the formation of the fetus. Things that impact the mother also impact the fetus, as well as the woman’s own body can impact it. I’m glad you find it interesting too!
Dear Matt, I feel I have a lot in common with you and want to share a bit of my story. I was once a practicing Jesus loving Christian. But over many years, experiences and talks with many Christian pastors and clergy shortly after being “Born Again” I became convinced that the Christian God and his so called Savior, Jesus was a merciless, hateful, revengeful, unloving, callous, disrespectful, blind, and stupid entity that had no purpose in my life. Furthermore, the faith I invested in the superstitions of Christianity brought nothing but disappointment and sadness to my life. As I have rejected my Christian beliefs and embraced more positive and life affirming practices (homosexuality) I am a much happier and loving person. However, at times I am lured and enticed to return to the bad habits of Christianity (after Christmas sales, Easter egg chocolate, getting drunk on St. Patrick’s day) I really wish (not pray!) I could change my desires forever but I feel at this point it is a natural part of me and I should just embrace and love this part of who I really am. So I know how you feel. Please keep me in your thoughts, I am a VGL, Versatile, Top with a Madonna fetish.
Matt,
I go thru the same experiences each day. I just accepted Christ as my savior 10 months ago. I found a good bible based church Edgewater Baptist. So where do I start. Matt, some people get a miracle immediately and are changed instantly but God said to me that I would have to walk down this winding road for miles and miles with all sorts of ramps along the way but if I stay the course that he set out for me I would reach the end, the light, everlasting life. Each day is a struggle and Satan loves to steal, kill and destory so each time I have a lustful thought, satan is there to tell me how bad I am, God doen’t love me anymore but Matt that is the furthiest from the truth, He gave his only son to die for me, he loves me so much, here is a prayer that I quote
“In Christ, there is nothing I can do
that would make You love me more, and nothing
I have done that makes You love me less.”
“Your precsence and approval are all
I need for everlating joy.”
“As You have been to me, so I will be to others.”
“As I pray, I’ll measure Your compassion by the cross
and Your power by the resurrection.”
See, Matt, I too was a homosexual and I also am not asking to be a hetrosexual, I ask God to help me in his time with my homosexual fleshly desires, the lust I have for men, the fleshly desires I have for men. Matt it is not easy, each day I struggle but I do not allow satan to to tell me how bad I should feel, I simply remember that Christ went thu hell to get to that cross and he did absolutely nothing wrong all for me and you.
Matt, I don’t know why we were born this way but what I do know God has a plan for both of us, A BIG PLAN, I can hardly wait to find out what he wants me to do.
I will continue to ptay for you, brother you are loved so much by God just sit down and feel his majestic Love for you in your heart.
Sincerely, your brother in Christ,
Michael
You will always be what you are, you can blame god or the devil, it does not matter.
Matt–
Please, please, please just stop. Your actions are destructive. Here in Portland, Oregon, where I proudly reside, a young man named Jadin Bell recently passed away. Jadin was from Eastern Oregon. Kids at school bullied him to the point that he hung himself in the schoolyard. A passerby noticed and got him down, but it was too late. After being transferred to OHSU and kept on life support for a short time, it became clear that he was brain-dead, and he was removed from life support. A short time later he died. His parents (who were very loving and supportive of their gay son) now have to bury their sweet, blameless child.
The school that should have protected him obviously did not do nearly enough. The kids who bullied him into suicide had to have learned their hatred for gay people somewhere. And that’s where people like you come in, Matt.
Your function as a poster-child for the toxic and false “ex-gay” movement serves to reinforce the message that “Gay is Not Okay.” When gay kids hear that message over and over and over, it becomes irrevocably branded upon their soul that they are rotten, no good, sinners, trash, vile, despicable.
If you tell me that I am worthy of death long enough, I will willingly participate in my own destruction.
If you call me names every day, beat me up, tell me to kill myself, eventually I will.
If you help to spread hateful, homophobic poison, you have the blood of gay children on your hands.
You are a part of the problem.
Stop. Just, please, stop. Your actions are impeding society’s progress. You cannot for one second tell me that your sexual urges are one bit different today than they were before your “conversion.” The difference now is that you have piled exponentially more shame and self-loathing on top of them.
It’s not too late for some kids, though, and if you and your ilk would please, please, for the love of all that is beautiful and right in this world, SHUT UP FOREVER, maybe we could stop encouraging kids to bully each other to death.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/02/04/jadin-bell-dead-gay-oregon-teen-hanging_n_2617909.html
There’s an article about Jadin. He should still be alive. Regardless of your wrongheaded beliefs, I think we can agree on that much. No child would “choose” to be gay in America today. Knowing what lies in wait at school, no one would choose to inflict that much suffering upon themselves.
Please. Just stop. You can keep hating yourself forever if that’s what you choose, but until you stop spreading lies, you have blood on your hands.
Sincerely,
Ross
Matt,
I was once a young gay teen scared to follow through with my natural urges because I thought I’d burn in hell for eternity. I hope you can find solace in knowing there is no hell to worry about. I mean, where is it? In the core of the Earth? That’s preposterous. Further, there’s no omnipotent being reigning over you, watching your every move, making sure you don’t put the wrong thing in your mouth. You’re brainwashed, kid. Realize that before you inspire others to follow some crazy idea that you’re going to be saved from homosexuality. You can’t avoid who you are.
Hi. I just stumbled on this and wanted to say I’m sorry for what you’re experiencing, I understand in some ways how it can happen, and i believe it is possible to have a future and hope without continual self-recriminations and guilt…even while admitting and understanding sin. The continual self-recriminations and living in guilt would wear on anyone and it has to start fading eventually or it would simply be too much of a weight to live under and build a life under.
I mean, even though you might be guilty, like I am in different ways, when you repented you were washed from it by the blood of Christ. By reading your post, it doesn’t sound like you were nearly as comfortable this time around with your giving-up period…i would say that sounds like the nudging of the Holy Spirit since now he’s in you… before you received Christ and repented, it didn’t sound like you had that nudging, so there’s a difference there.
My somewhat relateable experience involved being born into a cult and resultant sinful lifestyle, and i still deal with guilt and feeling like i’ll never really be the same as others or be ‘clean’ again….if i ever was. It is better than it was though I have less bouts of depression and anger, and i think it will always affect me in different ways. And yes sometimes I’ve been tempted to just give in and lose some of the progress I’ve made by stopping to struggle and stopping all the work of studying, changing…etc. For me, the easy choice was/is to reject religion altogether, but I can’t/don’t want to do that because of what Christianity means to me. But living this differently than I did before, and from how i was raised, takes so much effort and I don’t relate well to others sometimes…..and yes, sometimes it’s tiring, but the tired feeling i get is a good kind of tired
and i see good things happening around me and in my family as time passes.
So I wanted to say, you can do it Matt! You’re not solo on this…it helps sometimes to know that others are going through similar problems
maybe just in different ways.
It hasn’t been that long since you changed and left your past, and i really think that over time it will become less difficult and less depression/guilt and there will be more in your life that’s new and to be proud of… I’ve noticed that as time passes and I progress in my life post-cult I gain experiences and accomplishments and my past has started to mean less and less and dominate my life less and less. It’s still there and probably will be for quite some time, but it will get less prominent…
Also that Christian counselor you’re going to sounds like a great idea
i haven’t gotten in touch with one yet myself but it just seems like it would be such a helpful thing to have somebody helping who’s actually studied the mind/psyche, etc.
If you are suffering from depression, please please do not see a Christian counselor but a secular one. Depression is dangerous and can’t just be prayed away. Also, you need a neutral party to seriously discuss the fact of whether your depression stems from your struggle over your sexuality. Maybe, just maybe you would be happier accepting your homosexuality while maintaining your relationship with God. There are thousands of pro-LGBT churches out there that will not judge you or condemn you for being who you are. You are still young – there is a path to açcepting who you are and a path towards misery and self-hatred. Please choose the right one.
I agree with you. Here is a video from a pro-LGBT church.
I hear your goal remains the same, Matt Never give up Matt. Good is always in the future for those who follow Jesus.
Grow up little girl.
Get help. Secular, licensed psychiatric help. Judging from your blog, you have an acute case of narcissistic personality disorder. You should really work through these matters in private.
I don’t want to minimize your experience, but being on Grindr is not the end of the world. You gotta love the media and on-line buzzards making a mountain out of a molehill. Way to kick a guy when he’s down. The Lord is more than capable of seeing you through this, and so much more.
So what are your thoughts of that little boy who had to hang himself on the playground because of people like Matt?
Matt,
God has never promised that we will be free of all temptation. He made no special promise concerning sexual temptations.
If you stumble, just pick yourself back up.
See this video.
Lyrics:
Silence is Golden but there’s a time to speak,
And there are those shouting their views, but their arguments are weak
Let me get this out there and make it simple and plain
I never knew of anyone who found freedom from a hate speech in Jesus name
Reckless pastors, who judge, condemn and leave a soul to feel alone
Called to shepherd God’s people, not cast the first stone
And other leaders do no favors by cowardly choosing silence
They fail to speak the truth, and offer no guidance
A culture full of tension over the issue so where does that leave us?
Somewhere between awkward silence and gay bashing in the name of Jesus
And in the middle stands truth, a truth that can set us free
A God that calls us out of darkness to embrace our true identity
In a culture that glorifies sex and puts pleasure before all else
Is God the source of your identity or is it your sexual self?
And how do we identify and not accept a lie
Because sexual desire is just one piece of the pie
Identity is a choice a lifestyle is something you embrace
Same sex Attraction doesn’t define you and can be set in place.
A movement with semantics aimed to change and sway
There needs to be clarification when using the word gay
Does it mean one has attractions or that they choose to act them out?
Truth says there is a difference in the two that must be brought about
God loves you the way you are and the truth can set you free
There is a difference between unchosen sexual attraction and chosen identity
In marriage two become one flesh, open to life for propagation
Two of the same in union can’t reach this fulfillment of God’s creation
Nature or Nurture you didn’t choose this struggle
The Church understands and will walk with you in times of trouble
The same Church that says no when we fail to keep our sexual selves in check
Is the same Church that says no when others try to take your respect
You never are alone and the Church offers you a home as it stand for what is true.
Although the Church says no to gay marriage it still says Yes to you.
Fr. Claude (Dusty) Burns
Aka Pontifex
8/13/12
A Spirit Juice Studios Production
© 2012 Spirit Juice Films. All Rights Reserved.
Matt, I hope someday you can see that being gay and being Christian are not mutually exclusive. I hope someday you can stop denying who you really are and I hope someday you can love yourself exactly how you were created by God. It is your life and you can choose what to believe of course, but for your readers, they need to know that being gay does not equal being bad, or being sinful. Love is love, love is natural…and love is beautiful. Being gay is who you are…and that’s awesome.
“I need to stop denying who I really am and worship the Lady of Fatima.”
“I need to stop denying who I really am and curse the Name of God.”
“I need to stop denying who I really am and have sex with my stepmommy.”
“I need to stop denying who I really am and murder this person.”
“I need to stop denying who I really am and defraud people out of billions of dollars.”
Notice a pattern here?
Yeah. The pattern that you think “Who you really are” is defined by fleeting instances of thought
yep. good observation.
There are few things more pathetic than self-hating homos like you, Matt. And yes, you’re still totally, 100% gay – the fact that you’ve chosen to deny your true needs and desires for the sake of religion doesn’t change that at all. It’s unfortunate that you have so readily assimilated what was clearly the anti-gay thinking that surrounded you when you were growing up.
If you want to be a pathetic, self-hating homo, Matt, then go right ahead. But where I put my foot down is when people like you go out and start telling other gay people – particularly those struggling to accept themselves because they had homophobic upbringings like yours – that they should also be self-hating homos and deny themselves true love and pleasure and happiness. And I put my foot down even harder when people like you support political efforts to make it as difficult as possible for homos like me – those of us who have the courage to accept ourselves and be happy with what we are – to find love and happiness with things like gay marriage bans, thwarting anti-discrimination laws and the like.
You might as well leave Grindr, Matt. I think every non-self-hating homo has a moral duty not to touch you with a 10-foot pole. You’re too gay to have a woman, and you’re too much of an a*****e to have a guy. So enjoy your wasted life.
So, a man who has the hots for his stepmommy and chooses not to have sex with her must be a self-hating straight, right?
Oh please, there you go with the false equivalence that you homophobic Christians are so fond of throwing out whenever somebody challenges you. There’s a difference between having consensual, non-incestuous sex with an adult and having non-consensual and/or incestuous sex with a child. Not sure if you’re aware of the distinction.
that was not the point, the point was does urges make everything ok. pedophiles, exclusively wanting to have sex with kids, were they born that way?
IluvYHWH, the “facts” that you cite sound like they came from the likes of Paul Cameron, who has been widely discredited and disgraced in the psychology and sociology professions.
Second, you might be surprised to find that many gay men, myself included, aren’t into anal sex, while many straight people are.
As for your argument that it wouldn’t be proscribed in the Bible if it was acceptable, I’m afraid that the social rules of Middle Eastern desert dwellers from 3,000 years ago aren’t exactly relevant to today’s world where we have a much deeper understanding of things. I’m willing to bet you also believe the world is 6,000 years old, too, because some ancient holy book trumps overwhelming scientific evidence for you.
who’s Paul cameron? if you respond to something you might wanna say what it is because by now it’s a gezillion posts here. And I do know that some gay men don’t do anal sex, but most do, you should know that. and the way you talk about the authors of the Bible and the ppl therein only reveals your ignorance. They were no less smart than anyone today if anything, they were smarter. Look at the state of the world today. I’m not gonna list all that is wrong but to look back and talk about them as if they were stupid, well, it only reveals your lack of understanding anything. Your contempt for ancient cultures is your poverty, and re: homosexuality, it’s been denounced by every major religion on the planet, and for millennia. So, the PC movement trying to pretend that is not the case, only reveals your desperate attempt to in any way you can justify it. You should also respect our love for God even if you don’t believe in the Bible. Respect is a two way street.
IluvYHWH – Wow! There’s a lot of obfuscation here to unpack. Let me take it one-by-one.
“who’s Paul cameron” – He’s an old, closet case “ex-gay” nutjob who, like you, is fixated on gay male anal sex. You should look him up. You’d have a lot in common.
“some gay men don’t do anal sex, but most do, you should know that” – You “know that” how exactly? This is a fallacy. Many gay men do not partake in anal sex. However, a great many straight men LOVE the anal sex, both giving and receiving. I’m well-researched on the matter, unlike you who’s just going on what you’ve read on the internet.
“They were no less smart (the authors of the bible) than anyone today if anything, they were smarter.” These desert dwellers believed that a thunder storm was a sign that some god was angry with them. Does that sound smart to you? Not only weren’t they smart, they weren’t overly creative either. They didn’t even write their own stories. Must of what’s in the bible can be found in stories that earlier cultures told members of their tribes. So, unless they had a time machine this means that the borrowed the stories, tweaked them a bit, and pretended they belonged to them.
“Your contempt for ancient cultures is your poverty, and re: homosexuality, it’s been denounced by every major religion on the planet, and for millennia.” Lots of things have “been denounced” one way or another but that doesn’t mean we shouldn’t progress as a society. Not too long ago it was thought that black people should be slaves. That women weren’t smart enough to vote. That it was acceptable for older men to marry barely post-pubescent girls. Heck, people were burned at the stake for being witches. Thankfully times change. Attitudes change. Thinking people understand that gay people deserve the same rights and freedoms as everyone else. Anti-intellectuals don’t.
“You should also respect our love for God even if you don’t believe in the Bible. Respect is a two way street.” On this point you and I agree. Respect is a two way street. I believe that you have the right to believe in god and everything that’s in the bible if you choose to but, re: the two way street, you in turn should respect the fact that I do not share your beliefs and that I have the right to live my life as I see fit.
Take care!
IluvYHWH, you’re wrong on so many counts. Paul Cameron is a disgraced rogue scholar whose phony “research” forms the basis of many, if not most of the arguments that fundamentalist Christians use to demonize gay people, including the “gay bowel syndrome” one that you used.
I don’t have “contempt for ancient cultures,” and I recognize that ancient people were just as smart as people today. But they were also incredibly ignorant and don’t know nearly the same things that we do today. For example, ever wonder why the Americans and Australia aren’t mentioned in the Bible? Because the people who wrote the Bible didn’t know they existed! The same goes for the germ theory of disease, the laws of thermodynamics, the theory of gravity, the theory of evolution – the list goes on.
Regarding the Hebrews’ sexual norms, they were based less on “morality” than on a rigid patriarchal system that demonized pretty much any non-procreative sexual activity.
Concerning religions’ stances on homosexuality, it’s flatly untrue that “every major religion” condemns it. Ancient Hindu temples had male sacred prostitutes who serviced male visitors, and same-sex relationships were widely documented and accepted in Hindu, Buddhist, pre-Christian European and pre-Columbian societies. It’s really only when the Christians and Muslims came along that anti-gay attitudes became widespread. Even when Buddhist or Greek thinkers appeared to have an adverse attitude toward same-sex relationships, those were more individual opinions and not official dogma; Buddhism actually considers fundamentalism a sin, unlike Christianity, whose believers will often disregard scientific evidence that doesn’t fit their dogmatic beliefs (like you, for example), and many prominent Buddhist leaders have spoken strongly in favor of LGBT rights.
If you want to “love God,” then go right ahead – be my guest. I won’t judge you for that at all. But don’t go around demanding respect when you won’t give it in return. That’s the problem with so many of you Christians: You stick your noses where they don’t belong – like in our sexual and personal lives, condemning us as immoral perverts, yet when we so much as raise a peep of objection, you act like we’re the ones persecuting you. That’s called “privilege,” my friend, and your straight Christian privilege is just as ugly as male privilege or white privilege when you use it to try and keep us from being happy. If you’re too blind to realize that, then maybe you ought to consider the possibility that being Christian doesn’t necessarily mean you’re a good, compassionate or kindhearted person – a Christian insensitive a******e who doesn’t know how to mind is own business is still an insensitive a******e who doesn’t know how to mind his own business.
But at the end of the day what any religion says about homosexuality is irrelevant, because it’s ultimately a scientific question, not a religious one. Homosexuality has been documented in virtually every human society throughout history, and hundreds of animal species. I know what you’re going to say – “Just because it occurs, that doesn’t make it okay.” But here’s the thing, IluvYHWH – nobody has ever been able to show that same-sex relationships are, in and of themselves, intrinsically harmful. The only thing that is harmful and leads to unhealthy behaviors among LGBT people is the bigoted attitudes of people like you. Matt Moore isn’t living in denial of his true self because it’s wrong to be gay – it’s because he was raised to hate himself for who he is by homophobic bigot parents.
You’re wrong on all points, and I am simply too tired to argue with you. It’s too late and I’ve already spent way too much time here. Just go back and read all my old posts. and yes, in some parts of Hinduism it was ok, but mostly not, in Buddism no, nor in any of the Abrahamic religions. Sorry, you’re wrong. Goodnite.
Urges don’t make everything okay, no. It’s more down to what the urge is and why that helps you determine that.
Exclusive pedophiles mostly are not born that way, but have a regressed sexuality that is often caused by childhood trauma, often their own abuse. Not many who suffer abuse as a child will become exclusively pedophiliac, nor will many even have pedophiliac feelings.
Of course we don’t find abuse to be the cause of heterosexual and homosexual orientation, which are more than urges, they are how we as human beings form romantic relationships.
IluvYHWH, you’re doing the same thing as SHOES THROWER – drawing a false equivalence, replacing incest with child sexual abuse.
Incest and child sexual abuse are harmful. A consensual relationship between two adults who happen to be of the same sex is not. Outside of the beliefs of a few religions, you can’t make any logical argument that two men or two women having sex is inherently harmful to anyone.
The notion that same-sex relationships are harmful is purely a religious belief, nothing more. If you want to think that, then go right ahead, but I’m not a Christian, so your beliefs are irrelevant to me.
a couple on things on that; when it comes to something like pedophile you explain why, but when it’s SSA it’s claimed you’re born that way. That is merely your guess, and if it caused you no harm, spiritually or physically, it would likely be condoned in the Bible, but it’s not. Our bodies are designed for opposite sex, and plz forgive me for being explicit, but the a-hole is an exit place, and contain feces. it’s unhygenic to say the least. you also now have scores of men who have to wear diapers due to too much anal sex. And what about women with strap-ons? how can you not say this is unrelated to gender issues/confusion.. we see it manifested in so many ways. If it was healthy and our bodies were designed for SSA these physical features would tetify for it. Futheron, the promiscuity levels among gay men are sky high. How do you think aids spread like wildfire? yet, it seems to be taboo to adress these issues because anything you say is called gay-bashing. Have you noticed how much Christians love Matt? Not agree does not equalize bashing. If anyone here is bashing it’s those who hate the Bible. Sort of self detructive and countering to their arguments I’d say..
Psychiatrists have often found why, so we can explain why. Of course they haven’t found this in all pedophiles. For orientation, psychiatrists haven’t found anything common to explain straights or gays, so we can’t use trauma to explain why. This is merely based on the body of evidence that the field of psychiatrics have found, not on guesses.
Some people believe as you do about the Bible, I don’t. But many people have found that their sexual orientation, whether straight or gay, does not cause harm spiritually or physically.
I forgive you for being explicit, but I will not degrade this into a discussion about sex. or people’s sex practices. This is much higher, and we are talking about urges and sexual orientation. You’re free to find thing that our bodies were not designed for bad, such as pierced ears, tattoos, oral sex, etc.
Gender confusion, or transgenderism, is an entirely different issue.
We do see knowledge about manking manifesting in so many ways, where we learn more and more about our diversity and learn things are not simply black and white just because we want them to be.
I advocate against promiscuity and unsafe sex, among straights and gays, as I hope you do too!
I did not call anything gay-bashing, and I would appreciate if you would to reply to things that I say. I am responding to you, not to the many other things that other people are saying. If you cannot handle having a discussion, then perhaps you would like it if I asked you to defend Westboro Baptist Church?
your reference to westborough church makes no sense? and you compare tatoos and body piercing to the difference in how male and female genitalia fit together and the result (creating life vs sterility)? that’s a stretch to say the least. I am glad you advocate against promiscuity, but why is the pattern there to begin with? I think that what harms us spiritually will be left for God to determine. You can have your beliefs and I mine, but the LBGT movement have an agenda and part of that is not allowing anyone to think differently than they on this, and you can rest assure that a lot of us Christians will not let that fly. And that is why they vehemetly denies that anyone has changed and gone from gay to straight. However, going from straight to gay is perfectly ok. and never pndered upon Plus, they advocate a whole lot more, incompatible with Biblical teachings. You must be aware of that? and how do you deal with that if you consider yourself a Christian?
Alex
you may want to read up on pedophiles more because they do want to form relationships.
Quote ‘ He went on to say, “True pedophiles have an exclusive preference for children, which is the same as having a sexual orientation. You cannot change this person’s sexual orientation. He may, however, remain abstinent.” ‘ Van Gijseghem, psychologist and retired professor of the University of Montreal, Oct. 15 2011
http://www.greeleygazette.com/press/?p=11517
I’m sorry you didn’t understand my reference to Westboro – it was an attempt to make you talk to me and the points that I make rather than others. Just like I would do the same to you, rather than the points that a church such as Westboro makes.
And no, I was comparing what the body wasn’t designed for to what the body wasn’t designed for.
The pattern of promiscuity can be found among gays and straights because we are all tempted by the sin of lust. Often, when people do not have a support system, or face struggles, they tend to give in to their sins to find brief respite.
The LGBT movement have an agenda of equality – and I understand that some Christians do not believe that LGBT people should be treated equally under the law, and a lot of Christians will do what they can to keep discrimination in place and continue to make it a hard world for LGBT people to be themselves.
And no, people don’t go from straight to gay. They don’t go from gay to straight either. They go from denying who they are to accepting who they are, or vice versa.
And you are correct that many people, straight and gay, are not Christians and do not care to advocate Christian principles. Considering myself a Christian, it does not matter to me what straight non-Christians or gay non-Christians advocate. Why should it?
Kathy, I didn’t see in that link where they talk about forming relationships.
so you deny there is a pattern among specifically gay men to be highly promiscious? that’s denial Alex. and the LBGT movement have a lot more than equality on their agenda. I am all for everyone being treated with dignity and equal opportunities in jobs etc. But, by the same token, they have no right to impose their beliefs on religious institutions. And the whole discussion about gay marriage is not about human rights, it’s about what marriage is. It’s defined as one man one woman because that is what forms the nuclear family. Other variations do not, not polyarmorous unions, not gay unions, and not polygami. They want to change the definition of the family, which will, and do, affect kids. that’s no small matter. They also advocate for abortion rights, (murder) and the whole transgender/transsexual thing, they want that normalized, and now there’s even doctors who give pills to kids to stop their puberty so they can choose what sex they want to be. This and more is what they advocate. So, how can you be a Christian and not be outraged at what they’re doing? And btw; you saying noone goes from gay to straight and straight to gay is a lie. Flat out LIE.
“And btw; you saying noone goes from gay to straight and straight to gay is a lie. Flat out LIE.”
You’re certifiably insane. Please print up your entire comment and let 10 random people on the street read what you wrote. They’ll be calling the men with the white coats to come and pick you up. I’m shocked that you even have access to the internet. Not just that, I’m surprised that a troglodyte like you even knows how to type. You sicken me. YOU are an abomination.
No, I never denied that many gays and straights are promiscuous, in fact I affirmed that. And it is because they have their own struggles.
The lgbt movement has equality on their agenda. I am not sure what else you mean
LGBT people cannot impose beliefs on others, you are right. People have to come to acceptance on their own.
And marriage is the union of two people in a bond to join two as one, and governments recognizes that- gender discrimination does not matter marriage marriage. And the discussion about marriage is about being treated fully equally under the law. Which gays are often denied, like immigration rights that heterosexual couples can have.
Gays do not need to change the definition of families. They already are and have families, no change needed.
Transgender people are a separate issue, in which gays often do support transgender youth struggles for equality. As they should!
So, i can be a Christian and support equality and love and their families because that is what Christianity is about. Loving thy neighbor as thyself. Jesus’s one commandment! I realize people struggle and face hardships, but I support them and their families because that is Christian.
And yes, I have seen no one shown that a change in sexual orientation/ attraction from homosexual to heterosexual, or vice versa, is possible or a choice. Many choose to deny our accept themself, though.
Alex, you’re not sure what I mean by referring to other goals set by the LGBT movement? how can you not? they advocate for a whole lot more than “equality” plus, their version of equality is not always about equality. First off, you didn’t adress my points about marriage “equality”. It’s not about equality, it’s about defintion. You define it as between two people, that is a defintion. But you don’t care if it’s the same sex, that YOUR defintion (and not the Bible’s btw). You denonce it to by between more than 2 people, so you draw a line. However, when Christians, and others, draw a line to keep it between one man and one woman, you claim it’s not about equality. And even though LGBT ppl can have civil unions giving the same legal protections they demand marriage, that’s because of their agenda. And same sex couples is a sterile union, it is wholly unnatural for children to grow up in such a situation, and you have no idea about the far reaching phsychological consequences about that, and frankly, no gay couples seeking kids care about that profound aspect. Artificial ways of producing kids is about as unethical as it gets, for ALL, gay or straight. It ought to be outlawed. And part of the LGBT agenda is abortion on demand. Isn’t that odd since they can’t produce children to begin with? but still it is, and abortion is murder. Yes, they have an agenda, and it is to overturn the role of the nuclear family and advocate that anything you feel makes it alright. You can never ever suggest that a transgender person may need to solve psychological issues, by for them to eat artificial hormones and do invasive things to change their bodies that they demand should be accepted, oh and paid for. Sorry, but they are 100% contrary to Christian teachings.
As far as I see it, the goals set by the LGBT movement are clearly about equality, to be able to live their lives just as everyone else does, with the same opportunities and responsibilities that other people have. It is equality, and it is about equality.
About your points about marriage, marriage is not defined by gender discrimination. I will copy what you may have missed. Marriage is the union of two people in a bond to join two as one, and governments recognizes that- gender discrimination does not matter marriage marriage And the discussion about marriage is about being treated fully equally under the law. Which gays are often denied, like immigration rights that heterosexual couples can have.
You’re free to have your own definition of marriage that is defined by gender discrimination. And Christians are free to have their own definition, and disagree, as they do – because many agree that it shouldn’t be defined by gender discrimination.
Separate but equal is not equality. If you are saying one group can have civil unions, and another can have marriage, that is not equality, but separate but equal. If instead you were saying that we all should have legal civil unions, instead of marriage, that would be equality. You are free to push for that, but in the meantime, equality under one law is the agenda, and it’s going along quite well with now a majority (in the US at least) approving.
Fertility and sterility is not relevant to marriage, as we allow couples of both types to marry. You’re free to find many marriages “unnatural,” but there’s been studies upon studies of children raised by same sex couples – no need to fear far reaching consequences, just ask many of those grown up children today. You can pretend there is an issue, but nobody’s been able to show there is one, so it’s not as profound as you claim.
You’re free to also disagree with artificial means of production, but many disagree, and seek and use IVF, sperm donors, egg donors, and surrogates, whether they are straight or gay. And LGBT should have equal access.
Abortion is a separate issue than LGBT issues. When you figured out they don’t accidentally and irresponsibly have kids like many straight people do, you should have realized that.
The LGBT agenda is equality, that their families all be treated equally as nuclear families, and that no family needs to overturn the role of the other. And no, they do not advocate “anything that makes you feel alright.”
Transgender people often do need to solve psychological issues, which is why many do transition to get over their discomfort with their sex, and yes, their agenda is to be treated equally regardless of where their sex or their gender lies on the spectrum, just like intersexed people.
Some people believe it’s 100% contrary to Christian teachings, of which you haven’t mentioned any, but I don’t think equality is at all.
Thank you for your post, I hope now you see how it is about equality!
You’re a good man Alex. And you have far more patience that I.
Alex, you have not addressed or answered what I wrote only repeated what you already said. Gender discrimination can jut be exchanged for number discrimination, it’s about definition. And for you to hail artificial means of creating kids and say it’s ok and don’t affect them is 100% ignorant. You obviously have no clue how far reaching psychological consequences it has. And who are you, or anyone else, to decide the life of an innocent and deprive them of their biological parents. this is an area that should NOT be open for exploitation and sale. It’s about human rights for kids, not selfish adults. You have NO right to play with their lives.. And you state very proudly that you are for overturning the notion of the nuclear family, so again, I don’t know how you can exclude that whole section of the Bible. And abortion, you don’t even adress it although it is one of the LGBT movements agendas, which is to support murder. Every angle you look at it, it’s about selfish wants and zero concern for kids. and if you think marriage should include anything else than one man one woman, it shouldn’t be called marriage. That has for 2 000 years been based in the Bible in the western world, in fact the entire world it’s been man and woman until now (it has included polygami but not homosexual marriage) and so then all of it should be called civil unions. Don’t hijack a name that does not mean what you want it to mean. For Christians (who believe in the Bible that is) it’s offensive.
I apologize, if I haven’t addressed or answered your question, I must not understand it fully. Would you please rephrase the question?
I don’t think number discrimination is a bad thing – as opposed to gender discrimination or racial discrimination. People can state the definition of marriage is between two people of the same race, or that the definition of marriage is between two people of the opposite sex, which they can whole-heartedly believe. But advocates of marriage for interracial couples and same sex couples fight for equality under the law, where an individual’s gender and race are not relevant to how they are treated. Where a white male, white female, black male, black female, can all exchange positions, and the law treats them the same. That is equality. You’re free to think that equality shouldn’t be an issue, and that discrimination should be found in the definition of marriage.
I haven’t hailed artificial means, I said people are allowed to. And you are true that children who grow up biological may have different perspectives than those who come around via IVF, or sperm donation and egg donation, or surrogacy – just as adopted children have different perspectives. But it is okay for families and for children to be this way, and nobody should be making children feel like they are any less important.
Since you claim I am ignorant and have no clue, perhaps you should state what you know instead of insinuating? Are you the child of one of those relationships, and is that why you feel so strongly about this?
You’re free to your opinion, and think that all parents are selfish. I think however that parents who want to take care of and raise a child are selfless. I don’t consider being a parent “playing with a child’s life.”
And I never stated, much less very proudly, that I want to overturn any family or notion of family. I can see you will not listen to what I say, and have strong emotions that may have clouded your comprehension.
Abortion is not part of the equality agenda of LGBT citizens.
I can see that all you want to do is attack people as selfish and with zero concern for kids, despite the facts that there are many selfless LGBT people who have families and children that they love and care very deeply about.
And you’re free to be offended that only Christians who agree with you don’t get to define the world, and don’t get to be the only ones to use the term marriage. You’re free to be offended by equality.
ever heard the phrase “don’t equate your sin with my skin”. Applies here. No, it’s not about equality, it’s about definition, and the LBGT movement have stated that abortion on demand is on their agenda. You should know that. You’ll have to answer to God one day, as will I, but I tell you, this is what Jesus said this about children in Matthew 18:6 “But whoever is a cause of trouble to one of these little ones who have faith in me, it would be better for him to have a great stone fixed to his neck, and to come to his end in the deep sea.” I’m gonna leave you with that.
Yes, I have heard that phrase, and I am not equating skin with sin. I am comparing your skin color to your gender. Both can be considered skin. I am also comparing interracial relationships to same sex relationships. Both can be considered sin, if you will, as many have.
Many considered it fine for blacks and whites to be equal, but interracial relationships were sin. Many considered it fine for men and women to be equal, but same sex relationships were sin.
It is about equality, and you can try to define marriage as being discriminatory based on gender or on race, or define marriage as being inequal, but saying inequality is in the definition doesn’t make it not about equality.
The LGBT movement has not stated that abortion on demand is part of their agenda. Please do not lie. It is very unbecoming of a Christian.
I’m glad that there are LGBT and straight parents of children that are no cause of trouble to children, but who love them and raise them completely. It saddens me that there are those who would create trouble where none is due to their prejudice of a child’s parents, but I cannot help them. They must as Jesus for forgiveness.
Gay people do have an agenda. You’re quite correct. Everyone in the world has “an agenda.” Christians have a agenda – to force their ideals and beliefs down everyone else’s throats. They want their chosen lifestyle to be followed and believed by everyone else. If we don’t we’re told that we’re an ABOMINATION and we’re going to hell. Radical, far-right christo-fascists demand that they be listened to, that they be respected because THEY AND ONLY THEY know the one true god. What about the Jews, the Muslims, the Hindus, the Buddhists…what about their gods? NO, say the radical, far-right christo-fascists, they are DECEIVED. The only god is the christian god. They who do not follow him will burn for eternity in the fiery pit of HELL.
Do you see where I’m going with this? It’s not helpful. People like you have taken on a set of talkin points which are used to attack gay people. We ask for the same rights and freedoms that many straight people take for granted, you say we want “special rights. “We say we want to right to marry, you say “if we allow same-sex couples to marry then why not three people, or a man and a child, or a man and his sister?” Obfuscation is your game. You try to muddy the waters to take the collective eye off of the matter at hand – equality.
Just look at what you wrote. You bring in abortion, procreation, artificial insemination, so many things that have nothing to do with the fact that my 23 year same-sex relationship is every bit as special – even more-so – than the marriages of the thrice-married adulterer Newt Gingrich or the thrice-married drug addict Rush Limbaugh, or the 24-hour marriage of Britney Spears, or the super-fake, only-got-married-for-money-and-attention marriage of amateur porn star Kim Kardashian. Shining examples all of the alleged sanctity of marriage. If the heterosexuals – and there are many, many more like them – are allowed to make a mockery of this fine institution “that’s remained unchanged for thousands of years” (what a cosmic lie that is!!), why should two gay men who’ve been together for 23 years, a couple that’s more than demonstrated that they accept and relish the responsibilities that come with commitment, why should they be denied the right to marry?
I think you’ll find the answer is: they shouldn’t be denied. Marriage equality is coming to the United States, whether or not you agree with it. You can talk about artificial insemination and the fallacy that gays won’t make good parents (like heterosexuals have done SUCH A GREAT JOB…), anything and everything to try to stop it. Happily, you can’t.
you don’t get anything I say, at all. We have been discussing the LGBT agenda, and what it involves, and all the perverities that come along with it; abortion – murdering kids, and artificial insemination, denying them their biological parents, one or both. That’s downright demonic.
I get what you’re saying. I just reject what you believe. I am gay and I want equality. These “perverities” of which you speak are nothing but attempts to obfuscate from the topic at hand. We want equality. The other things that you mention are not the exclusive domain of LGBT people. Abortion rights, artificial insemination…these are things that some gay people and some straight people support. If you choose not to support those things, that’s your prerogative. As far as “denying them their biological parents, one or both,” I’m assuming you’re talking about couples who look to artificial insemination as a means to have a baby. Again, not exclusive to the gay community. To be honest, of all of my gay friends who are married and who have children, none have gone this route. They’ve all adopted children. Older children who would otherwise have been left to rot in an orphanage because they were considered “too old.”
They are not equal.
Nor are blacks and whites equal, but we treat them as such under the law.
Nor are Christians and Jews equal, but we treat them as such under the law.
Nor are men and women equal, but we strive to treat them as such under the law.
Do you understand what equality is?
“They are not equal.”
Says you. The majority of Americans believe that they are. Deal with it.
@ Alex I agree with ostracario you are a good man.
The only point I was trying to make is that those with various sexual preferences also consider themselves to have a sexual orientation and want to form relationships based on that. They also consider it ‘loving’ in their own way.
I don’t want to get dragged into the mire of what makes it different but for example there was a recent article in the Advocate about two brothers who say the have a loving relationship. There are more examples.
In our democratic society we argue and debate these things to death until we make laws. But a Christian believes God has already made the laws we should follow so we look to the Bible.
Now before you start talking about shellfish and different types of fabric it’s important to read the Bible word for word. God made laws specific for the Israelites civic and ceremonial but He declared universal moral laws which extend to all the world and every person or persuasion.
The marriage equality issue is about religion vs state. If the state institutes marriage via the legislative system then they do it by the will of the people , as ostracario points out. However churches should stand by the Biblical definition of marriage and should be allowed to preach on it, which is part of our religious freedoms.
I understand that some may think what they have is a sexual orientation, but a sexual orientation is clearly defined as describing an enduring pattern of attraction that is romantic or sexual (or a combination of these) to persons of the opposite sex, the same sex, or to both sexes, as well as the genders that accompany them.
For example, “miscegenists” may consider themselves to have a sexual orientation of miscegenation, but I consider that a “racial orientation,” where their pattern of attraction is directed to persons of a different race, same race, or both races.
I am not sure why you put ‘loving’ in quotes, but I believe it is to acknowledge that we all understand when talking about pedophiles, the other side of this is a child, who is not ready to understand love. We understand that interracial, same race, same sex, and opposite sex couples among adults contain two people who can consent and who can love. If a pedophile is in love, and the child is in love (actual love, not fake ‘love’), then they will understandably wait until the child matures and can consent and comprehend.
Of course there are some examples of two brothers who have a loving relationship, just like there are examples of brothers and sisters who have a loving relationship.
It’s important to read the Bible as a whole, I agree, not just words that people like, as often is done. Only as a whole can it be understood.
But the marriage equality issue, like the interracial marriage issue, is not about religion vs state. Religion may have their opinion, and religion can keep it. In all states with marriage for same sex couples, religion is continuing to follow their own rules, and they have not lost. Religion and state rules are separate. States have civil marriage, and churches have religious marriage. That is how it is proceeding, how it has proceeded in all states and countries, and how it will continue to.
Oh Kathy, you started off sounding so calm and rational, saying that you agree with me that Alex is a good man…but then you had to go here: “…there was a recent article in the Advocate about two brothers who say the have a loving relationship. There are more examples.” There are examples of these things among straight people as well. Does that mean we should then say that their loving, caring, monogamous relationships shouldn’t be allowed to exist either? If we allow a man and a woman to marry, why not a man and his 12 year old niece? These are straw man scenarios dressed up as justification to discriminate.
As you might have read by now, I’ve been with my husband for 23 years. We got married 7 years ago when marriage equality was made law of the land in our home country, Canada. To many Canadians the fight against marriage equality in the U.S. is something unimaginable here. We had our naysayers and we believe as you do that “churches should (be allowed to) stand by the Biblical definition of marriage and should be allowed to preach on it, which is part of (their) religious freedoms,” but we also support each citizen’s right to be treated equally under the law.
I’ve heard all of the “arguments” from your side: Adam & Eve, not Adam & Steve (that still cracks me up); if we allow two men to marry, how about three people or a man and a horse; marriage has remained unchanged for THOUSANDS OF YEARS (not true – until very recently most marriages were arranged and women were merely chattel). I’m with you though, let’s not talk about shellfish or women who wear pants (Dt 22:5) or all the other alleged abominations. All I know is this – we’ve have marriage equality in Canada since 2005 and none of the “slippery slope” arguments presented by the anti-gay marriage side have become a reality. More happily married couples and our divorce rate has gone down.
Believe and say what you like but please do not assume that those of us who believe differently must be subject to your interpretation of a bible that we may or may not believe in.
This is all so tragic. You are wasting a wonderful life torturing yourself. I know, coming from a fundamentalist background as well. Dude, you are gay. Accept it and have a great life. There is nothing wrong with love.
Just behave with dignity and class, meet a nice guy and settle down into a nice life. It is just that easy.
All of this hating yourself is completely unnecessary. Looking at these comments from the outside it sounds like one of the worst cults you’d ever hear of. Run, don’t walk, away from this.
You can still be a loving, spiritual man and a gay man.
So right on. Matt, you are a gay man. You will never find peace until you accept that. Embrace it and find your soulmate. God loves you the way He made you…and now it’s your turn to love you!
Not true, there’s absolutely no way you can remain gay and truly love God at the same time. You love God, then God will heal you of this affliction, simple as that.
Of course there is, and there are so many gay Christians out there who live happy lives choose to God.
God has no need to heal you of what he wants for you, as Matt knows.
Gay is not an affliction. We are born gay, those of us who are gay. The reason Matt is so conflicted is because he’s been told that being gay is SIN. Really? Y’all sin each and every day. The only difference between you and me is I was born gay, therefore I am who I was born to be. Y’all sin and lie about it, which is an even bigger sin. Then you’re all self-righteous and you tell other people that THEY’RE sinners…god knows you’re lying. And prideful. That makes you an abomination.
Ah, I feel sorry for you, and everyone here who needs to judge you by what you deny in yourself. There is nothing wrong with you that the Bible and Christianists with an agenda didn’t put in you.
K… Alls I gotta say at this point is that some people on here are cool; others…not so much. I used to be subscribed to the comments, but then I got like a million emails and it was just way too much crap to read and, quite frankly, annoying. So I’m leaving now and won’t be making any more comments here.
I’m out.
PEACE
Matt, I feel a really heavy burden to pray for you right now. I ask God to protect you and keep you safe; to hold satan back and give you victory. Hold on and know that God is good and God is great. In Psalms, David says, I would have despaired if I had not seen the goodness of the Lord in the land of the living. Do not despair Matt.
Wtf… Anyone know how to unsubscribe? I thought I did, but apparently, it didn’t work. :/
I am not subscribed, but I assume the option would be at the bottom of one of the emails you receive. Or, it will lead you to a page to manage subscriptions
Matt, it’s me again, kurt_t.
Listen, I’ve read some of your other blog posts, and many, many comments, and I see that I am not the only commenter thinks that you might be involved in a cult and that you might be the victim of cultic abuse. Particularly the move to New Orleans as part of a “church plant” sounds really cultish to me. Also, it sounds like you were recruited at a very vulnerable time in your life and that you’re being discouraged from thinking for yourself or trusting your own thoughts. You say you’re experiencing depression, but it sounds like you maybe feel that treating your depression in a conventional, secular way is not an option for you, and that situation kind of says “cult” to me.
I’m not saying any of this as a judgement. I’m not trying to start an argument, or pick a fight or accuse you of doing something foolish or bad or wrong. I’m just telling you what I observe, what your situation looks like to me. To me, it looks like cultic abuse.
And if you get to a place where that’s what it feels like to you, please understand there are lots of resources out there for you. One place to find help is a group called reFOCUS. (They are googleable.) I have no affiliation with that group. i just know about them because I’ve seen their website.
Something needs to change, Matt. Figure out what that something is.
Your depression will continue. God doesn’t want you to Be someone that you’re not. Just Be.
Matt,
Thank you for your candor and accountability. Through the grace of our Lord Jesus Christ, He will bring you through. I continue to pray for you as I know what you are going through (I struggle with SSA as well).
May the Lord bless you and keep you.
Daniel, why do you struggle? I’ve been in a loving, caring, monogamous same-sex relationship for 23 years (married as soon as we were legally allowed to in 2005) and I’m here to say that you don’t have to live your life in solitude. You don’t have to live your life feeling shame and regret for being gay. You were born gay. Accept yourself and accept your life.
These are the experiences that teach us humility and patience with others. Just roll with it and don’t let it roll over you.
This guy is the reason why we still see young gay kids still killing themselves! If there is heaven, and hell, I’m sure this man will never go to heaven for all the hatred he spreads!
“Pray that God would bless that, and that He’d show me what else I need to do in order to get my mind working right and my heart in full submission to Him. I don’t know that I’ve ever really been happy, or joyful, before… even though I’ve said that I have been. I’ve had spurts of happiness here and there, but it always seems to soon be drowned out by depression, sadness and fear. I’m ready to be happy……..not in sin, but in God.”
I believe THIS is the underlying problem. I’m praying for you, Matt. I know what it’s like. I also want you to know that regardless of what I write here and on my blogs, I truly believe you know Jesus (but I don’t). True knowledge leads to repentance and submission and conversion and faith and joy and love. It’s a progression. But full repentance must come first. And it will take time – hours or days, not minutes. There’s more to repent of than gay desires or thoughts or deeds. We must repent of the totality of our sinful selves – heart, mind, body, and soul.
We’re all unworthy sinners, all undeserving of God’s grace. Don’t think you’ve sinned more or less than others. Don’t beat yourself up (as I have since 2005, off and on). Don’t put yourself on a pedestal. Don’t let others do that either. Put Jesus alone on a pedestal – in word and deed. Look completely away from yourself (good, bad, and ugly) and look only at Jesus. I fear some of your feelings are an unhealthy focus on self in disguise. I know what that is too!
Please don’t listen to the people here who say gay is okay or God made you that way. That is gross darkness and lies. Reject the devil’s lies and embrace God’s truth. That truth always hurts. It means being a traitor to ourselves. We’re spiritually naked before God, just like Isaiah (6:1-10), with nothing to cloak our sin. We realize we have unclean lips and live among a people of unclean clips. Only when we see our sinful selves for who we really are, accept God’s just punishment and Jesus’ payment, can we receive God’s grace and love and be free.
God bless you, Matt.
I understand that some people believe as you do, and that you must believe that people who say “gay is okay” have gross darkness and lies, but in reality it is not. I understand this hurts, as it is better for you to find gays as an enemy. But there are gay Christians, and Christian allies of LGBT people, who understand that accepting yourself as God accepts you is not bad, and can help people who struggle. It doesn’t help everyone, and gay people have their struggles just like straight people.
But I agree that we should reject the devil’s lies and embrace God’s love.
Thanks for this Alex. Hopefully your message of love and support will bring comfort to many.
Gay IS okay Kelley. I was born gay. I am proud to be gay. I’m proud of my loving, monogamous, 23-year same-sex relationship. I’m proud that as soon as marriage equality was made the law of the land we got married in 2005, 7 years ago. I’m proud of our life together and our accomplishments. But I’m saddened by Matt’s latest “fall.” I read the account of his Gridnr dalliance and it was something out of a journal belonging to a person on the road to a nervous breakdown. Matt needs to quit the cult that he’s hooked up with a see a real counselor, one who won’t tell him that he’s evil and broken and going to hell.
Kelly: How do you KNOW that God didn’t make him that way? Isn’t ‘knowing the way of God” a sin, too? How can you speak for God with such certainty, and for the devil with equal certainty? Isn’t mystery part of God’s great gift?
Jesus said: 11
¶ Blessed are ye, when men shall revile you, and persecute you, and shall say all manner of evil against you falsely, for my sake. 1 Pet. 4.14
¶ Ye are the light of the world. Joh. 8.12 ; 9.5 A city that is set on a hill cannot be hid.
15
Neither do men light a candle, and put it under a bushel, but on a candlestick; Mk. 4.21 · Lk. 8.16 ; 11.33 and it giveth light unto all that are in the house.
All three of you are nuts! Gay is not okay, ‘gay Christian’ is an oxymoron, even if people are born gay (which I’m not convinced of), they can change through the power of the Holy Spirit (which none of you seem to know anything about). And being born X doesn’t mean you get to stay that way. We’re ALL born sinners. Does that give us the right to remain sinners and affirm instead of deny ourselves? No. God says we must repent of sin, and yet we’re born that way! We must die to ourselves completely – sinful nature included. We must say no to self and yes to Jesus. We must be born again to righteousness. We must not give the members of our bodies to sin but to holiness.
Have any of you read the Bible? Or do you read the parts you like and throw away/ignore the parts you don’t? Or do you have the audacity to interpret the Bible to suit your sinful, unholy desires?
Talking to you three is wasting my breath because you’ve rejected God’s truth and embraced the devil’s lies. I think you’re all children of the devil, deceiving and being deceived.
Re: Have any of you read the Bible? Or do you read the parts you like and throw away/ignore the parts you don’t?
Do you follow these as well?
Lev 20:9 “‘Anyone who curses their father or mother is to be put to death. Because they have cursed their father or mother, their blood will be on their own head.
Lev20:10 “‘If a man commits adultery with another man’s wife—with the wife of his neighbor—both the adulterer and the adulteress are to be put to death.
So did you eat bacon? Now you’re going to hell for this because your bible says so!
I understand you must believe that we are “nuts” and crazy, but look around you in the world. There are tons of gay Christians, and Christian gay allies, as well as non-Christians. We are not all crazy, as much as you might like to believe.
Gay is okay, straight is okay. It’s what you do with your relationships that is okay or not okay. And yes, you can be gay and Christian, as many are – no oxymoron.
There is no evidence of people’s sexual orientation being replaced with another by any means. There is not one example of someone who has been shown to have attraction to the same sex only, then lose that, and gain attraction to the opposite sex.
You are right that gay and straight people are born sinners, so they should seek to repent of sin and seek a life of value and love. Get rid of our sinful nature of lust, and say yes to the love of Jesus.
Yes, I have read the Bible, as have many gay Christians. And we read it all, without ignoring or throwing away parts, but understanding the pieces all as parts of a great whole.
The Bible can’t be used to serve sinful, unholy desires – but it can be used to support love, because God is love.
I have not embraced lies of the Devil nor rejected God’s truth, though I understand you must believe that. And you may think I am a child of the devil, just like I may think your hatred makes you a child of the devil, deceiving poor LGBT people who will listen to you. But thinking doesn’t make anything so.
Homosexuality isn’t love. It’s lust. It’s also God’s condemnation on those who reject to worship God and instead choose to worship idols or themselves. Homosexuality is the result of spiritually turning inward on the self – instead of outward toward God. It’s of the devil because he perverts natural God-given desires. The devil’s great sin is pride. Homosexuality is the result of man’s pride, generations of it. You have deceived yourself.
You believe what you like. I still think you should do what I said. Go seek professional help. If my loving, caring, monogamous, 23 year same-sex relationship of the devil (who doesn’t exist by the way) and perverted (we’re not “practicing” enough for it to be perverted), then so be it. I’d rather live my life with the love to end all loves than be worried that Yahoo! Voices wouldn’t print my anti-gay rant. Take care!
The love to end all loves = Jesus, not a human being. What you call love is perversion and lust. You’re just too mired in your own darkness and sin to see that.
I go to sleep every night holding my boyfriend. You hold you bible.
Homosexuality can be love, or can be lust. Heterosexuality can be love, or can be lust. It’s even study-able, there are different brain reactions to love and to lust, and homosexuals can and do experience both emotions, like heterosexuals.
You’re free to your belief that same sex attraction / sexual orientation is God’s condemnation, or love or lust, but it is not. Matt has not rejected God, for instance, and has not spiritually turned inward. He has turned toward God, and he is still who he is, and still with his sexual orientation. Just as straight people are.
Straight people do not turn gay when they reject God, or when they worship idols, or when they spiritually turn inward. People are either gay or straight. Gay people are not straight people perverted by the devil one day.
Homosexuality and heterosexuality are the result of diversity, the result of hormones influence on the brain’s formation of sex.
I have no reason to deceive myself, and homosexuality has been around for centuries – I am not gay because of my ancestor’s pride – how absurd! I am gay because it’s how my brain works.
Love and lust are two separate things, and we can see that, for gay and for straight people can experience both. You don’t need to be in darkness, light, sin or repentance to understand that.
To 220Lily: Thank you for the Christian Love you have shown here – but casting me as deceitful and as a tool of the devil. One wonders, would Jesus have done the same?
Jesus was kind to people who were honest with themselves (and him) about sin. He was never kind to self-righteous hypocrites, people who thought they didn’t need a Savior or refused to call sin sin. You fall into the latter camp. So does everyone who believes homosexuality is not sin.
Name-calling is not helpful. You call us self-righteous hypocrites and tell us to shut up. We think it’s you who’s actually a self-righteous hypocrite, as well as being a deluded, deranged, christianist cultist.
If that’s what you think I am, so be it. I gladly will be called a fool for Jesus if only I’m not a fool to him. What the world calls folly, heaven calls wisdom. We must throw in our lot with Jesus and thereby condemn the world and its sins, regardless of the earthly cost. We gain heaven that way. Wisdom is giving up what you cannot keep to gain what you cannot lose.
I don’t know you. I don’t know what to think of you. I do know that you’ve only felt “love” for two people in 33 years and one of them is Matt Moore, a gay man who’s allegedly left the “homosexual lifestyle.” A man whom who’ve never met.
You don’t know what love is or what it means. Agape = unconditional self-sacrifice. Phileo = conditional friendship. Eros = conditional marriage. What you call love is eros. But homosexuality is a perversion, lust rather than eros. True eros is a self-sacrificing conditional marriage, a binding commitment. What I call my love for Matt is phileo. You’ve perverted friendship love, both same- and opposite-gender, into lust.
Zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz.
I fear it’s you who doesn’t know true love. You’re in love with Matt after all.
No, I’m not! What a perversion! Phileo = friendship, a spiritual bond. You’ve never experienced that with anyone.
@220lily
re: No, I’m not! What a perversion! Phileo = friendship, a spiritual bond. You’ve never experienced that with anyone.
Who are you to judge me? According to the bible, that’s not your job. The bible also says that people like yourself, who are sowers of discord (Prov 6:19), are an ABOMINATION. And since you’re trying to be a good christian perhaps you should spend less time online attacking people who don’t agree with your rantings and more time on self-reflection. I think you need a few more bible studies. You seem to have lost your way.
I’m not a sower of discord. I’m a speaker of truth. God’s truth always divides – those who believe and those who don’t. You’re the one who needs Bible study. You’re the one who’s lost your way.
@220lili I haven’t lost my way because I’ve never believed in your god. Thus I don’t have to live by your god’s alleged rules. Rules which were made by iron-age desert dwellers. If you choose to live by their rules, so be it. I’ll live by my own.
What time’s your bible study?
Your lifestyle is evidence that you don’t believe in my God, who is the only God Jehovah, God has many rules. They’re not ‘alleged.’ And they weren’t made by ‘iron-age desert dwellers’ either. God’s law is the only law. You just choose to obey your own selfish desires. You say no to all law and all morality. And you will suffer in hell for it. I pray God cuts you off!
@220lily “You just choose to obey your own selfish desires.” You don’t know anything about me. If you’d even lived with and been in love with someone for 23 years as I have you’d know that to make a relationship last that long, and to still want to be together for another 23 years or more, neither one of you can be selfish.
“You say no to all law and all morality. And you will suffer in hell for it.” When did I “say no to all law?” I obey the laws just as well as the next person. Better than most I think. As far as morality goes, yup. I’m as moral as they come. Most certainly more than you so-called christians. I’ve been with my husband for 23 years and I’ve remained honest, faithful and true to him. I respect him and the sanctity of our union. We’ve only been married for 7 years but right from the start we pledged to one another that we would remain monogamous. If there came a day when either one of us felt that we could no longer keep that pledge, we would go our separate ways. Thankfully that day has never come.
As far as “suffering in hell,” I’ve already told you that I don’t believe in god so, safe to say, not hell either. Since hell doesn’t exist, no suffering. I’ve suffered enough trying to engage you in a thoughtful debate. It’s like trying to have a proper discussion with a child. Tedious and painful. You’re almost as anti-intellectual as those iron-age desert dwellers who cobbled together the books of the bible.
“I pray God cuts you off!” Proverbs 6:19 You’ve proven yet again that you’re an ABOMINATION. Poor lily.
No god, no hell, no law, no morality, no Bible? You’re the abomination. You’ve been deceived by the devil. Until you wake up and repent and receive God’s truth, you will go to hell. There’s no hope for you.
@200silly – “No god, no hell, no law, no morality, no Bible? You’re the abomination. You’ve been deceived by the devil. Until you wake up and repent and receive God’s truth, you will go to hell. There’s no hope for you.” God, you’re one of the most obtuse christianists I’ve ever encountered, and that’s saying a lot. God doesn’t exist. Hell doesn’t exist. Why would I repent for something that I didn’t do to a sky fairy that doesn’t exist. I’d have more lucky talking to the tooth fairy. At least she delivers money for teeth. You need to learn reading comprehension. I follow laws, just not your sky fairies laws. I’m more moral than you. And I’ve been able to keep a relationship going and remain very much in love and committed to one another for 23 years. You can only hope for that.
I don’t believe in god so I can’t be an abomination. You on the other hand, you’re a sower of discord. You’re mean and spiteful and you – well, at least you haven’t told me to shut up today. Do you wear pants dear lily? (Dt 22:5) If so, you’re even more of an abomination that I though. Repent lily. Repent!
No. Jesus wouldn’t have treated you this way. Don’t mind lil. I think she’s having a bad day/month/year.
I am kind to people who are honest with themselves, and those who are not. Even those who are not honest about their sexual orientation deserve kindness.
I don’t try to be self-righteous, or pretend I am holier than anyone. I don’t criticize your belief or say you aren’t as holy as me.
And I don’t be hypocritical, and don’t say I don’t need a savior. All people, regardless of sexual orientation, do.
And I don’t refuse to call sin sin. I just refuse to call love a sin.
Your words betray you, 220lily, but don’t worry, because you can still be saved.
Homosexuality is NOT love.
MATT: Moses chose to suffer affliction with the people of God than to enjoy the pleasures of sin for a season (Exodus 2:15; Hebrews 11:25). You’re not alone. You know it’s all about eternity, not this world. Joy forever there, not empty ‘happiness’ which is really darkness and sin for a short while here – and then eternity in hell as these people have chosen.
Homosexuality is not love or lust, and heterosexuality is not love or lust. It’s what you do with your sexual orientation that can be either love or lust.
Love is not empty happiness, that is lust – Love is full happiness, and love is not darkness or sin, it is warmth and light and God and it lasts an eternity, with us now and in the next life.
There is only one sexual orientation = straight. Only in that (and only done rightly) does God delight. All other orientations are sinful and wrong and unclean and unholy.
You’re the kind of “christian” that give the rest a bad name. I do believe that you are self-righteous. You’ve proven yourself to be here today. Mean and spiteful as well. That’s to be expected when one of your true loves in Matt Moore, a gay man you could never hope to be with. I’ll take my bit of happiness and thank the lord that I’m not you. Praise Jesus!
You don’t know Jesus. If you did, you’d repent of your sinful ways. You’d desire holiness. None of this is true of you. None.
You’re true to me darling. Truly entertaining. We’d had a hoot reading your comments aloud. Many of my friends here had no idea people like you still existed in 2013. You’re an iron-age relic.
Yes, people like me still exist. This year and next, you’re going to see them MULTIPLY.
Your denial of reality doesn’t make it exist less. It is a fact that there are gay people on this planet. It is a fact that these people are not attracted to the opposite sex, they are not heterosexual. They do not have the sexual orientation of straight. Instead, they have the sexual orientation of homosexual, where they are attracted to the same sex. This can even be tested.
And some people believe as you do, I don’t. Many don’t.
You don’t get it. I didn’t say homosexuals don’t exist. I did say that there is one godly sexual orientation for your body – straight. Gay isn’t morally right just because it exists. You have to fight the flesh.
I think we all got what you said. It’s just that we take what you say with a grain of salt.
It’s been fun but I’ve got a party to get to. If I’m lucky my husband and I can get into some “practicing homosexual” action.
Thankfully most christians aren’t mean and spiteful like her. Many of my relatives are born-again evangelicals and they not only came to the wedding my same-sex partner and I had 7 years ago, they gave us their blessing. I know lily will say THEY’RE NOT TRUE CHRISTIANS, and maybe tell me to shut up, but they’d say the same of her. Not the “shut up” part. They’re much too nice for that.
You actually said there is only one sexual orientation, not that there is only one godly sexual orientation.
But in any case, heterosexuals and homosexuals can choose the godly path, or the ungodly path. They can choose to serve lust, or seek out love.
Heterosexuals can’t choose to be gay, and homosexuals can’t choose to be straight. Gay and straight aren’t morally right because those people exist, they are morally right when you seek love and fight the flesh of love.
God changes people who can’t change themselves. God makes dead people live, blind people see, lame people walk, thieving people give, gay people straight, and alcoholic people sober. You’ve never surrendered wholly to God in order to let him change you.
Agape = unconditional self-sacrifice.
Phileo = conditional friendship.
Eros = conditional marriage.
What we call love can be any of these three. Heterosexuals can experience all three. Homosexuals can experience all three. Both people can experience all three with a partner.
Homosexuality is not lust, and heterosexuality is not lust. Heterosexuals and homosexuals can and do experience eros love, not lust. They can and do experience a binding commitment.
Gays do not need to pervert love, as they experience it all. As do straights.
Alex: Wrong, wrong, wrong.
Final message to Matt: faithful are the wounds of a friend but the kisses of an enemy are deceitful (Proverbs 27:6). Don’t be blinded by the pro-gay and pro-sin messages here, however “kindly” given.
God could change black people into white, he could change bald people into haired people, and he could change gay people into straight people. Or vice versa.
But we don’t pretend that all you need to do is surrender to God to fix everything you think is wrong with yourself. Black people are still black, bald people are still bald, and blind people are still blind, even with God. Because that is how God wants them to be.
Wrong!
God is love. Love is sacred and not sin. False prophets would have us believe otherwise.
Matthew 15:1 – 15:20.
2 Corinthians 3:6 – 3:18.
Galatians 5:1 – 5:6.
God is love but all love is not God. If what you call “love” doesn’t conform to God’s standard and definition of love, then it is anything but love. More like lust and perversion.
Lily:
You speak with such certainty. It is the certainty of a zealot. You write:
I did say that there is one godly sexual orientation for your body – straight. Gay isn’t morally right just because it exists. You have to fight the flesh.
How do you know that? Does God speak to you and tell you that?
Yes, he does. God speaks to her via her ipod earbuds. He tells her to be a self-righteous, sanctimonious ____ so we’ll all smite her and go to hell. Apparently we’ve all been so good lately they’re looking for recruits down there. Don’t try to engage her in an intelligent conversation. She’s far too gone. She’s in love with Matt. Typical. They’re always in love with the gay guys. Guys the can never, ever have. He is quite cute.
Lily, maybe you entered the wrong blog. Christians follow Biblical teachings, God spoke to Moses and Jesus, and Jesus spoke to Paul.. the Bible declares this, as does the physical make up of our bodies. You don’t have to agree, but you don’t have to ask such an ignorant question. And yes, God DOES speak to our hearts about this too FYI.
Dear Lily is one of those so-called christians who thinks that she knows all and the rest of us, christian and non-christian alike, know nothing. She’s just in a snit because she submitted a piece of writing to Yahoo! Voices and they turned refused to print it because they said that they don’t print opinion pieces that are not based in fact (or something like that). You’re read what she writes. Basically they told her than nutjob manifestos aren’t their thing. She blames them for being “pro-gay Liberals,” as though there’s something shameful about that. Oh, and she’s in love with Matt Moore, Says he’s one of only two people that she’s ever loved in her 33 years on this planet!! I know right, 33? Her rambling writing sounds as though it’s composed by a high schooler, one obviously no in the “in” crowd, hence the bitterness. Poor dear.
Yes, I’m a zealot – for God. He speaks to me a lot. Has he ever spoken to you? I doubt it!
God has said in the Bible countless times that homosexuality is sin. His desire for everyone is heterosexuality, within marriage. People may corrupt that with pedophilia, fornication, adultery, divorce, and masturbation. It doesn’t change God’s natural design or holy standard. He made us male and female to complement each other in marriage for life (Genesis 2:23-24). This marriage points to the greater mystery of Christ (male) and the church (female) in Ephesians 5:25-32, the wedding heaven will celebrate (Revelation 19:7-9). You don’t seem to want any of this.
Here’s my question: Why don’t you accept and embrace the man that God made you, and allow yourself to love and be loved, the way God intended?
Matthew 15:1 – 15:20.
2 Corinthians 3:6 – 3:18.
Galatians 5:1 – 5:6.
2 Corinthians 11:13-15 (KJV)
13 For such are false apostles, deceitful workers, transforming themselves into the apostles of Christ.
14 And no marvel; for Satan himself is transformed into an angel of light.
15 Therefore it is no great thing if his ministers also be transformed as the ministers of righteousness; whose end shall be according to their works.
God is love. Love is not sin. May you be guided by love.
Matt, all I see here is the testimony of a man searching after God. Plain and simple. No one is perfect. We are all going to stumble from. Does that make you a hypocrite? No. None of us are perfect. You’ve been honest and transparent. What more could anyone ask? Do not be discouraged by your own human imperfections. Do what you’ve been doing: pick yourself up and try again. And don’t be discouraged by anyone else’s imperfections either, namely all those haters out there point fingers and screaming hypocrite. You tell me which is hypocritical, to stumble and admit it or to demand perfection from the imperfect. The Truth is simple.
I pray that God bring you comfort and that he grows you and strengthens you.
~Steve
Matt, may you find peace and FREEDOM from the chains of shame that bind you so. I read your story and can’t help but wonder who did such a shaming number on your psyche? I would strongly encourage you to get a good book on recovering from shame. You seem to be keeping yourself in a perpetual cycle of shame by condeming the person God made you. To do so in such a public fashion makes me wonder WHO or what church provided you with such a poisonous self-disposition. I accept it if you want to continue your “forever public flogging” but you should really consider the turmoil, hurt and pain you are instilling upon those who are impressionable. Freedom is there for anyone who embraces the individual God made them. You’re selfishness and self-consumption with your struggle is manifest in your failure to consider your wife or the countless number of emerging gay men who will deny themselves the self-needed to have fulfilling relationships in life.
Sorry, meant…self-love needed to have fulfulling relationships in life.
“You’re selfishness and self-consumption with your struggle is manifest in your failure to consider your wife…”
It is selfish to think that someone like Matt could or should EVER marry a woman. I know many women who married “good, Christian men” who gave themselves over to god and wanted to please him. They prayed and they worked at it and for at least two of them, it consumed them. The marriages all ended in sorrow and pain. Don’t even try to tell me that they just didn’t work hard enough, or that it was satan and beyond their control. For a gay man to marry a woman and, in the process, destroy her life, just to prove that he’s not gay…that’s a sign of selfishness and self-consumption. If you’ve done this David, shame on you!
You must have misunderstood what I wrote. I would never support someone who is gay marrying a woman. In fact, I was saying that doing so is a sign of selfishness and self-consumption with the issue. You might want to get some anger management therapy as well as pick up a book on shame. Seems you are all to reading to shame others…
That was actually me being polite. Take care my friend. Once you’re done with that book of shame perhaps you can use it as kindling.
Why can’t you see that trying to warp your mind and deny who/what you are based on a bunch of hocus-pocus and fairy tales can only lead to depression and self-loathing?
Simply put–there is no god, there are no devils, no angels, praying is just talking to yourself, and the bible is a book of mythology. Accept who you are and stop worrying about whether or not a fictional character in a book is poised to punish you if you choose to be honest with and embrace your true self.
By choosing (and, yes, it is a choice…unlike your sexual orientation) to use a twisted text like the bible as your moral and ethical guidebook, you are setting yourself up for disappointment, shame, loneliness and self-inflicted unhappiness.
What a waste…it doesn’t have to be this way.
I wish I could convince you that there is absolutely nothing wrong with being gay. All I can tell you is that I have been with my partner for ten years, and we remain madly in love and happy.
I’ve been with my guy for 23 years, married for 7 years. Same story. Madly in love after all this time. But Matt and those of his ilk don’t want that. They want god to love them so whenever they “sin” and go on Grindr and then feel bad about it later (in spite of the fact that they didn’t “do anything”), god will forgive all. My boyfriend isn’t so forgiving. He at least make me clean out the garage.
Matt,
I have no idea if you’ll read this or if your mind will ever be changed, but I feel compelled to leave a short comment. I nearly killed myself because of the very same beliefs you claim to hold. I thought all I needed to do was give up all parts of myself to Jesus, not hold anything back, and I would be satisfied in him as a greater source of joy and love than the arms of any man. I resisted any physical contact with men until I was 31 years old. I was miserable. No matter how much I tried “turning over” my “struggle” to the Lord, no matter how sincerely I begged for the strength to love him more than anything, I longed for the love and affection of men, and specifically a handsome man of fine character that I could love and with whom I could build a life.
Through investigation of the evidence motivated by factors totally unrelated to my sexuality, I came to the conclusion that the God of the Bible does not exist. There is no actual evidence that he is anything more than a fictional character. There is no reason other than your deep indoctrination that you need to feel such self-loathing about the fact that you are gay. When I finally realized that about myself, and allowed myself to start dating men, I found that the desperate hunger went away because it was being fulfilled by real, meaningful interactions with quality guys. I didn’t go off the deep end. I didn’t start having unprotected sex with anything that moved. I didn’t fall into drug addiction. Neither will you if you can just love yourself and have some self respect.
You don’t need to derive your value from another man, and you don’t need to derive it from a god either. You are a sincere, if misguided, lovely man who really ought to be happy. Your mind has been polluted by superstition and nonsense. When you see that, and when you can find that basic internal regard for your own dignity, you will be capable of being happy.
I hope that you will value truth, evidence, and rationality over the bogus virtue of faith in ancient fairy tales. I hope that you will learn to value your own dignity without wasting too many more years seeking validation from what other human beings tell you about a fictional god.
With all my heart I hope the very best for you.
Why would anyone go on a Christian man’s blog to preach that God doesn’t exist? And you know, it’s really the height of human arrogance to think you can feel, think, be, have self awareness, but there is nothing out there greater than humans, and the universe(s) came into being by themselves and we’re all here by accident (science does not suggest that btw) and if you can’t see it, it doesn’t exist. I’m sorry for your narrowmindedness and flatlander thinking. You need to open your mind, not Matt’s. His mind is open. He knows God. You don’t and that’s your misfortune.
He knows god? He’s delusional and so are you. Get over yourself. Give me proof that god exists.
And fyi, the sun and the stars aren’t “proof” of anything.
I recommend a cilice and a flail in order to drive your god-given nature from your heart. No but seriously, I’m praying for you. I hope you come to shed the perverse, artificial notions that the church has imposed on you. I hope you come to honor the beautiful gifts bestowed upon you by the god who loves you, and I hope you come to see the beauty of His creation.
But stay off of Grindr, IMHO. The demographics on that app are not good examples of a healthy approach to honoring what you’ve been given, and it’s awash with the type of guys that might lead you to conflate homosexuality with sickness. If the only gay people you meet are the kind that are looking for a quick hook-up, you’ll have a wildly distorted notion of what gay people are like. Just a suggestion. There are better ways to meet good men whose spirits are intact. I’m sure there are a few on Grindr, but your chances of finding them there are bound to be very slim.
One thing that might be a balm to your soul would be to volunteer for an organization that helps gay and lesbian people. Charitable organizations tend to attract really good people and I find that helping others to heal can be the best way to heal yourself. The Trevor Project, The Pride Foundation, Stand Up, HRC, The Point Foundation, Gay and Lesbian Leadership Institute… You’ll find many wonderful people working there, and people could really use your help there. But don’t do it in order to look for a man; do it for the right reasons, let god guide your heart, and the right man will come to you.
Best wishes, man.
Matt, The way you talk reeks of impending suicide attempt lol. Worst thing is that you’re trying to drag others down this path of depression/repression. Get back on Grindr and have a good shag … you need it lol.
You’re really hurting the gay rights movement. It sucks that when I go out and try and make the world a better place for gay men and women, such as ourselves, you’re out doing this. You’re making it so hard for the LGBTQ community to rise above the bull shit. It just sucks even more because not only are you hurting a community that would love and welcome you as you are, but you are hurting yourself. Why you would ever want to turn to a God whom you believe does not love you the way you are and turn away from a tremendous, loving community is beyond me. I will pray for you, Matthew Moore, I will pray that God imparts the wisdom of love and acceptance onto you. I don’t remember much from Sunday school all those years ago, but I do remember that Jesus loved everyone. Don’t hate yourself Matt. I love you the way you are.
Just be yourself and accept that God made you who you are. Stop torturing yourself.
I’m really surprised to see so many harsh reactions to a young man of 23 who is going through some spiritual struggles. As a gay man myself, I can say I was exactly where he is when I was 23 and there was nothing malicious or “anti-gay” about my convictions to whole-heartedly pursue a life of faith. I believed God’s will was for me to live differently than my sexuality dictated but I wasn’t a gay-hater or self-loathing. Those of you who see his very existence as an insult sound a lot more self-loathing than he does. People need to understand that everyone’s path doesn’t have to look exactly like yours. I’ve been “out” (for lack of a better term) for years now and I see just as much DOGMA in the unwritten doctrine of how a gay male is supposed to behave as I ever did in the evangelical world.
Ya well Matt’s brought much of thin onto himself. It’s the language he uses. His second to last blog is entitled, “Leaving Homosexuality: The Real Power Of My Testimony.” Maybe this is all him or perhaps it’s the people he surrounds himself with but these are very specific words he’s chosen. He says that he was “broken,” which is so common now with the “ex-gay” types. Yes, I know, Matt says that he’s never “said” he was/is “ex-gay,” but the language he uses would make one think that he is. How can you “leave” something but not be ex-something? There’s so much more but I’ve spent way too much time here tonight. Zzzzzzzzzz.
The New Covenant is more glorious because of its superior function in God’s redemptive purpose (vs. 6-10). The Old Covenant, written in letters engraved on stones, was a “ministry of death” (v.7) and a “ministry of condemnation” (v.9). The New Covenant, by contrast, is a “ministry of the Spirit” (v.8) and a “ministry of righteousness” (v.9). The Old Law was a revelation of God’s glory, but it was not a full disclosure of God’s redemptive purposes. Human beings could never be justified by the works of the Law (Galatians 2:16). It could only bring condemnation. The Law of Moses was added because of transgressions “until the seed should come” (Galatians 3:19). Christ, however, enacted a “better covenant” upon “better promises” (Hebrews 8:6), the forgiveness of sins. The Law pointed forward to something so superior, the ministry of righteousness, that its own glory, however brilliant, was surely to be exceeded.
http://www.bible.ca/ef/expository-2-corinthians-3-6-18.htm
He has my pity, but nothing else. He’s brought all of this on himself. He is not true to himself or his god. By the way, it’s his god, NOT mine. And as for shoe thrower….you’re an internet turd and need to be flushed. You’re kind of hung up on Buggery… is it OK if you breeders do it?? A LOT of you do.
Matt, if you want to REALLY talk to your god, try a little rope and a sturdy beam. You’ll be conversing in a few minutes. Maybe shoe nut will join you for a little godly three-way.
^^^ Exhibit A: How to be a dick.
And he probably sucks it.
SHOES THROWER, your obsession with buggery and dick-sucking is… revealing. As a proud dick-sucker myself, I would urge you to just allow this for yourself so you can get it out of your system. Start slow, do some neck exercises first, you’ll get the hang of it. Best wishes!
I see all the comments that God loves you just as you are. Its true. But I don’t think that it means that God is ok with the fact that some people choose to embrace their sin instead of the cross. Same sex attraction is your burden. Others have different types of sin. Others don’t consider their actions ‘sin’ or ‘a burden’ and have no need for forgiveness. Their conscious is severed, much like the conscious of any non-believer who embraces Islam or any other type of path to Heaven or even atheism.
We can accept the burden of same sex attraction and learn not yield to it. But don’t expect it to happen in a year or two. Don’t ever believe that war is easy. You are in a war and it may last a life time. You may be attacked till the day you die. You can choose to stay in the fight or give up. I have been celibate for 14 yrs and it took 12 yrs of back-sliding to get to those 14yrs. I wish I could tell you how I made it through the wilderness of my sex-addiction, but I can’t. It really is a miracle.
The battle for your soul is already won, but you still have to fight it. There is no strategy. There is only grace (Christ), the Spirit, and God. The path to calvary is lonely even when surrounded by family and friends. All I can say is, don’t try to understand it but seek after that great reward of becoming one with God. Accept that ‘becoming one’ is just you and Him. You will feel alone and depressed, like a deer lost in the woods searching for water, but those seasons pass and your thirst is quenched with encounters of great joy.
You are still very young. Hang on. It gets rougher and it gets better too.
I don’t know you but I love you and wish you well.
Matt– It seems to me your problem is not that you are attracted to men. The problem is that you are addicted to sexual, meaningless trysts which are sinful.
Let me propose this question: If you were to fall in love with another man, and remain celibate within that relationship, would God condemn it? Is there any Bible verse you can quote to show that He would? Does God condemn any type of love? Is lust a type of love?
You have an opportunity to be a beacon for Christ in the gay community. Regardless of how you feel about celibacy within homosexual relationships, ask yourself: Am I conflating the sin of lust and extramarital sex with my orientation? That is, do same sex attractions, as you call them, define your so-called “sexual-orientation” (sex as in gender, not intercourse) defined by who God designed you to love?
I’ll be praying for you. I think it is right to step out of the public sphere and surround yourself with flesh-and-blood people from all Christian walks, listen to their stories, and pray and read scripture. God whispers to us in the silence, I think you will find it hard to hear Him with people like me and all the commenters above shouting our own opinions at you.
Matt ~
Get a book ~ “Prayers for Bobby”. Hope you can change to your true self. Read it.
Better yet, download the movie.
There is no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus! I am gay, and engaged. And, Itoo have faced the inner conflict of does God still love me? Fact is He does. When I have prayed for the Lord to have my way with my relationship, what He showed me was how to love deeper according to the Holy Spirit and not the flesh. I don’t know what Our Lord has placed upon your heart, or what the course He has for your life. All I can say, is take your deepest questions to Him, and ask Him and only Him. The bible wanrs us not to trust in man. That means not even putting a pastor or church head above what He has to say to you. Rather than focusing on your homosexuality issues, focus on getting to know God deeply. He will work out your salvation. Forgive yourselfand realize. He doesn’t see us the way we do. Love never fails, love covers a multitude of sins. Just breathe and go to the mountain of God to regroup. You will find this whole situation to be a beautiful way to draw closer to Him. God bless you and do not be discouraged.for God knows our rising and our setting down, for all the days our written in the book of the volume of us.
and He is faithful to complete the good work He started in you!
Congratulations on your engagement! I wish you and your fiance a long, prosperous and happy life together and with Christ!
What is sin and how do we define? What made the sin that Eve commit so bad. The fruit was attractive, delightful and enlightening and freeing from the dominion of God? Satan wants to see sin as good and yes It gives us a season or lifetime of happiness but its end is bitter because its ultimate outcome is death which is separation from God and the amazing blessing that he has for us. I wanted to address the definition of sin because so many here constantly defend their decision to embrace feelings about the gay lifestyle on the basis of happiness as the arbiter of what determines what is right. Paul warn us in Romans chapter one that God’s judgement and wrath is being displayed on this world by giving people over to their sinful desires and homosexuality is clearly included. It is God’s kindness that wakes us from this deadly cycle and leads us to repentance. He is being kind to free us from the spiritual blindness that used to engulf our lives. We as believer still have to deal with the sin nature entrenched in our current bodies but we are receiving new bodies one day that will be completely free of the sin struggle that seeks to dominate us daily. Christ came by his death to pay the price for sin which was impossible to pay by human effort or rightness and by his life, he now indwell in us by the Spirit who wants to lead us above the urges of the sin nature daily. It is getting crazy as people are losing the ability to discern between right and wrong. Our world is spinning out of control due sin in our world It is shocking to see killing and rampages as never before as people are losing their conscience. Some are now even advocating that incest is ok and other sexual appetites are now espoused as freedom. God loves the world so he sent his son but if we rejected his offer than we have condemn ourselves. It is rejecting a life-jacket that keeps us from drowning. The story is the same. Those who love Christ and his righteous will be hated since it is not our home. Christ loves you all and i pray that some here surrender to him in simple faith believing that he wants to dwell in you and love on you. He is better than the high of a relationship or sex. Read the new testament and it will shock you on how it is relevant for today.
“He is better than the high of a relationship or sex.”
I’m an atheist but curious to know what you meant by this one line. Are you saying that I should forget about my 23 year loving, caring, monogamous relationship with my same-sex partner (we’re married actually, since 2007), and give my life over to jesus? You mention sex specifically. Sadly, after 23 years together, we’re too busy working and travelling for work and paying bills and living life to experience the “high” any more…
Thoughts?
AMEN.
With the number of replies that this post has received I doubt you’ll be able to read them all. First thing I say is love yourself. Don’t judge yourself. Be kind to yourself. There are going to be so many people telling you what you should do. Only you can really follow your heart and your head. Take time to find out who you are, no matter who you may love. There are people that will come and go for your life for many reasons. Always be true to who you are. Also try not to condemn others, it does say in the bible don’t just others, lest ye be judged. Let people live their lives, treat them with respect, and you will be given this in return. Blessings
If all christians were as measured and kind as you, Matt wouldn’t be in the dark place that he is today. Although, he was the one (unless he was coaxed into it) who put himself in this position. Proclaiming to the world the he’d “left the homosexual lifestyle.” Full stop. As well all know, you can’t leave. It’s not like that. You can sublimate your true nature, but you can’t just turn your feelings off. The sad thing is that so many equate gay love with a sex act, and it’s so much more than that! As in any relationship, the act is but a tiny part of the relationship. I’ve been with my partner for more than 23 years and ours lives are full and rich and so, so much more than that.
ostracario,
God intended his followers to radically love each other without twisting it in sexually involved relationship only intended by God since the beginning for one man and one woman in marriage. We who claim to be Christians should be like family to each other looking out for each other. Our sinful nature has twisted what God has designed because he worship ourselves rather than God as shown in Romans 1. People have one thing wrong about sin, that it should always be miserable. Quite the opposite is true, it is generally happy and satisfying because people are naturally spiritually blind until the Holy Spirit opens theirs eyes with the preaching of the gospel and then they are horrified on how they were duped by the prince of this world who is satan that they are on the wide road leading to destruction. The Christian walk is a fight to the end but the goal outshines any relationship, experience or possession. What does it profit a man if he gains anything in this world but yet lose his lose is what Christ warned us. Believing in Christ opens us to a greater contentment now so much that our past experiences on earth seem so worthless and pale in comparison to the incredible joy, peace and love found in knowing Christ personally. Since are we are still in bodies tainted by the original fall, then we will still have the corrupted nature which generally uses feelings in its attempts to pulls us back. This is why it is important to walk by faith based on the truth revealed to us by the teachings of Christ who proved himself to be God, and the teachings of the writers who without doubt experienced God and were faithful to write it down for us. We also need other members of the body of Christ to be with us so we can strengthen each other. It amazes me how the bible so accurately predicated our current culture changes and what eventually will happen to believers who choose to walk away from sin and how much mockery and hate would be thrown at us for denying the instincts of the sin nature in us which is revealed by a attitude of self-gratification. Matt has a amazing treasure in him because God has put his Spirit in him but his sinful nature that dwells in us all will fight him daily and satan our eternal enemy will accuses us too to discourage us and every us who seek God’s holiness to the end because satan knows his time is running out and wants to personally drag with him as many as he can. We in love warn you because it is true. It will happened still if we remain silent about warning you to repent about sin and turning to Christ then your blood is on us. Love wants the best for others and sin is a lie from our common enemy who is satan. Continue to trust your feelings but reality one day will show that we really love you by warning about the true nature of sin.
Thanks for your response. I was raised in an evangelical community and that world will never be apart of my life. I respect your beliefs and if you choose to live that way, so be it. It’s not for me. I guess I’m an atheist. Not an Atheist (capital A). None of us knows what will happen to us when we die. Many christians claim to, but they don’t. They believe. If believing is to live a life like Matt Moore does, I’ll take my chances as a non-believer. Take care.
I’m sure “God” is going to fix all of your problems
Enjoy your 5 minutes of fame, bitch! You can be sure to get some hot self-loathing muscle stud who just *loves* jesus to come over and kneel with you. Oh, by the way: your message of bullshit sucks. Please, just shut the FUCK up already.
Matt is not a bitch, but you certainly sound like one, and he’s just one of the many being recruited into God’s army to expose the lies of darkness about homosexuality and we will never stop proclaiming the truth that this affliction and indeed all afflictions can be cured by God;s love, one day you may see the Light and it’s opportunities like this where you can make your choice, what will it be? Heaven or hell?
I think Matt, like so many others, are smarter and wiser and more honest than to claim that homosexuality can be “cured” by God’s love. He knows he struggles with it all the time, and has not been ‘cured’, and I think he accepts that he won’t be ‘cured.’
Aside from that, gay and straight people can and do still accept God’s love, just understanding that he won’t change what is his plan for them.
I think Matt is willing to go the distance, he’s willing to give it to God, whether he changes or not. that’s called sacrifice. It’s a Christian thing.. you can learn about it by reading the Bible. You on the other hand are putting YOUR beliefs onto Matt and every Christian who believes in the ancient Israelite stance on homosexuality. You don’t want to change, it’s obvious, that’s your business and that’ll be between you and God. But you have no idea about the power of God and what He can do with others who lay down their desires for His. So you might wanna back off and respect other’s beliefs regarding this issue. Oh, and give that memo to the entire LGBT movement.
Thank you for being honest with yourself here and with others that change can’t be expected. I’m glad you realize that people shouldn’t be going to God because they want to change, and you shouldn’t be promising that. There are many sacrifices we all have to face in our life.
I realize that you don’t care what I say, and will continue to lie about me putting my beliefs onto others. I will continue to reiterate as I have that people are free to their own beliefs, and I to mine. And while I respect their beliefs, I understand that you cannot and will not respect mine.
One day, God will open your eyes as he has mine.
your condescending words towards me won’t work. If you ever decide to be honest we could have a conversation. Until then, re-read all my posts, cause you didn’t (want to) comprehend anything I said.
I love the comments on here that are from other guys who struggle with “same sex attraction” and want to help Matt with his “problem.” Get a life people. Come out of the “Christian ex-gay, gay denying closet” and get yourself a boyfriend. And stop spreading this homophobic crap to our gay youth that they need to be anything other than the beautiful LGBT youth that they are.
I’m with you Lisa! I’m going to quote my dad here (never thought that would happen…)…I think Matt “got in with the wrong crowd.” He was confused about his sexuality – the drinking and the partying and the casual sex. He reached out and the people/pastor who was there to counsel him told him that he was “broken” and needed to be fixed. Matt’s obviously been a good boy and he’s studied all of the talking points as to why being gay is wrong. His writings are often angry attacks on those in the “homosexual lifestyle” (whatever that is). These people are always careful in their language. They call us “homosexuals” because it sounds more damning than gay. The word “homosexual” has the word SEX in it, and they feel that being gay is only about SEX. And sex is dirty and bad outside of marriage. Yet, they won’t allow gay couples to get married because of “Adam & Eve.”
If they were such a perfect couple, why did they get thrown out of the garden of eden? (Not that I believe such a place ever existed….) Poor Matt.
Wow. Religion sure has fucked you in the head, buddy. Sorry you got brainwashed into that mythological bullshit. Hope you make it out eventually.
Sounds like you’re already living a life of hell, so you might as well have some fun while you’re here! Man am I glad I’m intelligent enough to know the difference between myth & reality. Sexual orientation is not a choice, but religion is!
http://recoveredbaptist.wordpress.com/2012/06/06/why-opposing-gay-marriage-is-neither-conservative-nor-christian/
So. Gay or GOD. Come on, man. I am GAY and have GOD in my heart. I will be judged by GOD for not WHO I LOVE OR WHO I AM> I will be judged by GOD for what I have done. I will NEVER give that kind of idea as a choice. I love GOD> GOD LOVES ME> I am going to heaven unless I have commited a sin of such pure despite against myself and / or other men. And if ANY one wants to tell me that GOD LEFT ME for choosing to be GAY, as I accepted him into my heart as a boy, before any idea of my sexual orientation, I will ask that person to not make a judgement upon me till he has spoken to GOD him self and gotten that answer. GOD lives with me every day. And GOD does not defect the heart he has inhabited.
Live your life as you see fit William. So many of these alleged christians spend much of their time telling the rest of us that THEY know the true word of god, while you know nothing. You just don’t get it. You haven’t really been born again…like them. It’s all a bunch of nonsense. They cherry pick the bible, taking the bits that appeal to them and ignoring the others that don’t.
I’ve been with my most wonderful man for more than 23 years. If lovin’ him is wrong, I don’t wanna be right? Our love isn’t something dirty and sinful. It’s something wonderful and magical and, many days, it’s the only thing that gets me/us through. The support we give and get from one another, nothing compares. I’d rather live the honest, open and joyful life that I have then live in turmoil like Matt Moore. Life’s hard enough without subjecting yourself to such torment.
Take care!
There is nothing wrong with love.
There is everything wrong with same-sex buggery.
“There is nothing wrong with love. There is everything wrong with same-sex buggery.”
I guess my guy and I are in the clear then because that’s something we do not partake in.
I like how you left it open for straight couples. Buggery’s o-k, just not “same-sex buggery.” Got it.
“They’re all gonna laugh at youuuuuuu!!!!”
Being a gay christian is an oxymoron, it’s virtually impossible
Nope, there are many gay Christians who live great lives, single or with their partners, with Christ and their church. It’s not at all impossible to believe in Christ and accept your sexual orientation and live with a partner, though I understand others may believe differently.
There are many Christian denominations too, doesn’t make them all right just because they call themselves Christian, the Mormons call themselves Christian but that’s a whole other issue, just saying you’re Christian doesn’t automatically mean you are, if you don’t understand the Bible and only God can help you do that, you can twist it to mean anything you want, there is no such animal as a gay Christian, and any so called religion or church that says that there can be are just wolves in sheep’s clothing.
Right, out of the dozens or hundreds of denominations, only one can be right – or maybe none are!
And there are many out there trying to understand the Bible with God’s help, and coming to different conclusions.
I understand some believe as you do, and many don’t. There is such a human as a gay Christian, just like there is a straight Christian.
Sorry Alex, you can’t live for God while you’re screwing and getting screwed in the butt, or putting body parts in the mouth that have no business there, it just can’t happen, God intended parts of the body for certain functions only and I know what homosexuals do for pleasure, you live for God, you will live the way God intended and bring forth fruit (children) for his glory, not one homosexual or lesbian’s coupling in so-called love with each other can do that, will ever be able to do that and will ever be meant to do that. Get a clue.
I see you have decided to become very vulgar and unGodly and turn the discussion purely towards sex in your posts, which is depressing, but not surprising.
You’re free to believe what you like about forms of sexual activity between straights and gays. Some people believe that, others don’t. You know what heterosexuals and homosexuals do for pleasure, I don’t doubt that, as all people know sex is pleasurable.
You seem to think that somewhere along the line I have said that a same sex couple can produce a child together, and have told me to “get a clue.” I would ask that you do the same, and do not mistake what I have said. I have said no such thing. It would be wise for you to not confuse what others have said.
I do believe that straights and gays can live for God and do not have to abstain from all sexual activity aside from unprotected procreative sex, though you are free to believe differently.
No Alex, homosexual sex is vulgar, i feel no need to sanitize the truth of it because you feel it is un-godly, well homosexual sex IS un-godly and selfish, so you want to blame the messenger for bringing the truth about it up, and the clue is telling you there’s a reason why dysfunctional sex cannot bring forth life, you put a group of homosexuals on one deserted island and a group of heterosexuals on another one, in a hundred years which one will revert back to a deserted island, that’s the clue you don’t get.
So since all you have now is to focus on sex, ignoring everything else, which is quite vulgar, as well as lying and say that I don’t understand that a same sex couple can’t reproduce, you must be telling me you are done. If you would like to respond to the other content in my posts, and apologize for lying about me, then please do. I have no problem with the truth, nor did I say it, nor did I say the truth was ungodly – your actions are. You’re free to your beliefs, but you believing that relationships are selfish and calling you the messenger of truth, is not so. You believing it doesn’t make it truth.
Yea Alex, nice try, sorry, I’m not taking your bait trying to distract me from my point, attacking me doesn’t change the fact that sex is meant to be between a man and a woman, , not man and man, or woman and woman or man and dog or man and sheep etc etc etc. if you can’t understand the purpose of our sexual anatomy and how they mesh together perfectly only between a man and a woman, then you’re in denial (sin) I guess and there’s not much else I can tell you
Some people believe that, I don’t.
I can understnad the purpose of our anatomy, all of it, so I don’t know why you think I cannot even though I have reiterated that.
There is such a human as a gay Christian, just like there is a straight Christian. It’s not at all impossible to believe in Christ and accept your sexual orientation and live with a partner, though I understand others may believe differently. Whether you have kids or not, biological or not, adopted, surrogate, donor children, etc, you can still be Christian.
@steve j
Alex is much too kind to you. Say what you like about gay people. Spend more time thinking about anal sex than you do your own eternal salvation, and we’ll go on living our lives. Oh ya, and go f#ck yourself. Maybe once you do you’ll stop being such an a$$hole.
Sorry ostracario, that the truth upsets you, that’s why Jesus was crucified because the truth upset the powers that be at the time, I’m glad you’re not in power because you sound like the type that would crucify people like me and Matt. Talking about the misuse of certain body parts such as the anus for sexual pleasure by homosexuals may make you and Alex uncomfortable, but the fact is, the anus was not meant for sex just as homosexuality was not meant for God’s creation to engage in.
@steve j
You haven’t upset me. You’re an annoyance. Like a mosquito. You’re rude and crude and vile and yet you consider yourself to be a christian. A Westboro Baptist Church kind of christian. I’m an atheist so your interpretation of the bible doesn’t affect me one way or the other. I just got tired of you being so disrespectful to Alex who was being far more generous to you than you deserved.
Yes your profanity is just a sign of being upset about something, you call it annoyance, not really much difference, it’s still a negative and causes you to say and do not very nice things, I never called myself a Christian, and if you’re an atheist, then you’re the last person that should be telling someone how a Christian is supposed to behave because by your very admission, you don’t have a clue about Christianity, about God, about God’s people, and about the purpose of life itself.
@steve j
Not a christian? Oh, that explains it. You’re just a garden variety troll. No, they’re cute. You probably live under a bridge and service older gentlemen for $1 a pop. That explains a lot. Why you’re so fixed on the anal sex. LOL! Poor steve j. If your name was bill j we could make the proper abbreviation. That’s how I’ll think of you from now on. Little b j., under the bridge being of service to older gentlemen.
Actually it’s you homosexuals that resort to anal sex, not Christians, so don’t blame me for exposing the truth about what you do in private, but God knows what you do and God created your anus for one thing, not for sexual purposes, the fact that you can’t understand that just proves to me, Matt and others who see that homosexuality is indeed the abomination that God says it is.
Homosexuality makes a mockery of what God intended for us and no I’m not annoyed or phased by what you think are clever tho perverted responses to me because your words are empty and basically meaningless and lack any truth. Not sure what your purpose is coming over here to Matt’s blog spewing your nonsense, a long monagamous relationship in sin is still sin. And as I never said I was Christian, on the other hand, I also never said I wasn’t.
@steve j
You’re funny bj. Is it cold under the bridge tonight?
@steve j re: “Being a gay christian is an oxymoron, it’s virtually impossible”
Virtually impossible perhaps (in your mind), but not impossible. John Smid, ex-director of Love In Action, the “ex-gay” ministry of Exodus International, is a gay christian. He admitted he’d never seen anyone change their orientation from gay to straight and he apologized for telling people that they could change & that there was something wrong with them if they couldn’t. He now runs a christian outreach called Grace Rivers (http://www.gracerivers.com/tag/john-smid/) for “those who call themselves gay and want to seek a relationship with God in a place where they’re free to do that.”
Hope that helps.
Matt: I am an ex-ex-gay. God made you a beautiful gay man. A loving, monogamous, same-sex marriage awaits you when you’re brave enough to want it. Not all the gay community hates you. Please seek an LGBT minister who will not hate or condemn who you are.
I hope you’re not claiming to be a Christian the way to you talk to ppl? Yes it is a LIE, it’ a LIE from hell. I know ppl personally who have changed, happily and succesfully. There are ministries all over the US who have ppl who have. I am sure you know of Exodus too. You’re in denial, you’re rude, you’re a hater, and you’re either ignorant or a liar.
I’m not sure who this was meant to reply to, with you going on about “the way you talk to people,” that makes me assume it wasn’t me but some of the rest of it makes it look like what I was talking about. I haven’t been talking to people in any disrespecting way that I am aware of, so it must be someone else.
But as far as the rest, it’s not a lie. You may know people who personally claimed they have changed, happily and successfully, but there is no actual evidence they have changed from an exclusively homosexual orientation to a heterosexual orientation. It is likely that they could be bisexual, they could simply be repressing their same sex attraction, or lying when they tell you they don’t have it, etc.
I know of Exodus, yes. I have had several friends who have gone through Exodus. They don’t change people. They fully admit now that they don’t promise change. Alan Chambers, the president of Exodus Ministries, says it perfectly, and I am glad he is being honest, as many former and present members of Exodus have stated:
“I do not believe that cure is a word that is applicable to really any struggle, homosexuality included…. For someone to put out a shingle and say, ‘I can cure homosexuality’ — that to me is as bizarre as someone saying they can cure any other common temptation or struggle that anyone faces on Planet Earth.”
“The majority of people that I have met, and I would say the majority meaning 99.9% of them have not experienced a change in their orientation or have gotten to a place where they could say that they could never be tempted or are not tempted in some way or experience some level of same-sex attraction.”
Chambers has also said that he has same-sex attraction and for anyone to say he does not have temptations, or that he could never be tempted, or does not have same-sex attraction is not true.
like I said before, there are plenty of ppl who have changed, I know this for a fact, and you saying they were not all gay to start with can then be applied to exactly everyone else as well. You and the LGBT movement’s insistance on suppressing that people have changed declares that you are not interested in the truth, only in your own agenda. End of story.
I understand that you believe you know people who have changed from exclusive homosexual orientation to heterosexual orientation, but unless you have done scientific research to determine their orientation before and after and decided not to publish it, you would not know for a fact.
“And you saying they were not all gay to start with can then be applied to exactly everyone else as well.”
Great! Then you agree?
I have no need to suppress people who claim to have changed – they are free to come out and have their sexual orientation studied, but to date I have seen no one come out to prove that it can be done.
You can cite “end of story,” but the facts are the story. I am interested in the truth – not what people say, but what is observable fact. I would love for ex-gays to come out and be studied – or even better, for people going into ex-gay therapy to be studied before and after.
Of course as Exodus (which you decided to bring up, not me, so you should not be upset with the reality of them) admits they do not promise to change sexual orientation, I don’t see this being likely.
no, you’re not interested in the truth because when someone changes orientation all you do is say they weren’t really exclusively gay to begin with. So, you’ve safeguarded yourself to deny this no matter where or when or how it comes up. There are both studies and personal testimonies, and not giving a guaraentee (exodus) does not mean it doesn’t happen. That it hasn’t happened to all doen’t mean it doesn’t happen. Matt doesn’t believe it is right you you and others do not respect that at all. That’s certainly a double standard too.
I am interested in the truth. If you can show me evidence that someone changed their sexual orientation, I would welcome it. So far you have not. Recall that you yourself demanded scientific evidence. When someone claimed that people are born gay, you state there is NO scientific evidence as a means to deny that claim. And yet, now you have no scientific evidence to support your own claim. It seems you are not interested in truth – you are interested in what you want to be. You deny scientific evidence that contradicts your belief, and require no evidence to suppoort your belief.
Again, since I am interested in truth, you are free to show me evidence of someone who was exclusively gay to begin with – which IS and CAN be studied in scientific studies, we can measure sexual orientation on a scale by measuring arousal – and then you can show me evidence that they became exclusively straight. Please feel free to provide this evidence, as it would be amazing to see, and undeniably truthful!
Since you say there are studies, I would love for you to provide them. Thank you for taking the time! I figured with all your emphasis on this, you would have by now! I anxiously await the study you have, and I hope for your sake it actually says what you think it says!
I would also like to ask you more about Exodus. You brought it up of your own will, and have not commented on the things I have stated, and have not commented on what the President stated, about 99.9% of people experiencing no change. What do you think of Exodus? What do you think of the President’s statements?
I am not sure what you mean by “Matt doesn’t believe it is right you you and others do not respect that at all.” I think there is a typo. Matt himself states clearly he has never experienced a change in sexual orientation. So his personal testimony would of course go on my side. If you are talking about something other than change of orientation, then you should be clear. I do respect people’s right to have differing opinions, and I would appreciate it if you would not lie about me not respecting Matt’s right to his own beliefs. I have stated clearly in my post directed to him that I understand his belief.
Alex, you are not interested in the truth. You have one agenda; to defend your choices. that’s it. The LGBT movement is likewise not interested in tolerance, diversity or truth. They are actively working every day to shut up and shut down anyone who don’t agree with them. Dr Oz did a session of gay reparative therapy and was ripped for it because he showed both sides. That tells you everything you need to know, they advocate CENSORSHIP, as does your denial that anyone changes. A man was sitting on that show stating how he was ex-gay and, changed and happily married and this psych doc stared him right in the face and told him it’s impossible, basically. That’s what you;re doing too. It’s entirely impossible to have a rational discussion with you or anyone like you, (part of the LGBT-movement) because you will deny that anyone can change until you die to propogate your agenda. Here is one link for you, but so what? all you’re gonna do is say he wasn’t really gay, that’s your standard answer. i.e. it’s completely hopeless to get anywhere in anyway with you. Oh, and one more thing, you’re insulting Matt, because Matt claims he knows and hears from GOD about this, and you show NO respect for that but keep telling him he doesn’t and should do what YOU say is right. You’re encouraging a brother in Christ to NOT follow Scripture. You’ll have to answer for that one day.
http://p4cm.com/video/i-promised-i-wouldnt-tell
I can see you provided no evidence to support your claims, that is sad, but as I predicted. While I am very aware of the body of evidence and even acknowledge what Exodus says, you do none of that. Actions speak louder than words, and it is you who is not interested in truth.
I can see you have no interest in doing anything other than attacking me, spouting your own agenda of anti-gay attitudes, and demonizing all people working towards equality.
I think perhaps you should read Matt’s post, to see his own thoughts and how he agrees with me. The post titled “What Does God Expect From Gay People?” goes into how he understands that change isn’t what happens, and nobody should be promising change. Exodus doesn’t, so it’s sad that you still do.
I could tell from the moment you brought up Exodus, and then ignored what they say, that you were not interested in truth. Therefore, it is impossible for you to have a discussion with me about the truth when you won’t partake in it. If you change your mind, you know where to start – it’s all the places you’ve been missing.
I never insulted Matt, nor did I dismiss that he claims to hear from God about this. I never said he didn’t, so thanks for lying again about me. And I never said he should follow me – in fact, I said quite explicitly he should follow HIS path. I heard from God during my struggle too. I never encouraged Matt to do anything regarding following or not following Scripture.
When you decide to stop lying about me, that will be a start. Then you can start to acknowledge all the facts you ignored that I brought up. I don’t know why you decided to start lying, but when all my posts are here clear as day, it makes it obvious when you lie. You may think that the ends justify the means, but that’s something you have to explain not to me, but to God.
I have NOT lied about you, I have pointed out that YOU lie about Scripture. I say you are insulting Matt by accusing him of not hearing about God on this issue, because you are. I have not gone on about Exodus because I have simply adressed and given other examples all of which you dismiss, which I knew and I stated so because that’s the strategy of ppl like you. You have an agenda which is to shut down anyone who disagree and censur those who have another experience and have changed their “sexual orientation.” As far as I know Exodus is still alive and well. I am NOT demonizing anyone, nor am I condemning equality I have stated to you quite plainly that not agreeing with gay-marriage is about a DEFINITION of what marriage IS not equality. I’ve stated it over and over again. You not agreeing on that is your problem rooted in denial. I have the highest respect for gay ppl who struggle with this issue. I have ZERO respect for ppl who LIE about what Scripture says about it. AND want to shut down and censur and NOT allow ppl to follow and believe what the Bible says about it. That is WRONG. I see ZERO tolerance from ppl like you on this issue. So YOU might wanna start living what you preach, i.e. tolerance of different beliefs.
I can see that your emotions are running high and this is turning more into personal attacks on me, so I will do what I can to return it to the issues.
I understand that people who are intolerant of my beliefs may say I’ve lied about scripture, even when I haven’t brought it up. And I understand that people may have missed where I told Matt to follow his own path, and instead think I accused him of not hearing God, when I haven’t. I don’t expect an apology for these lies; I expect them to continue even though all they needed would be a quote from me to prove it, which won’t happen. My words on this page are enough evidence for me. I still encourage Matt to follow his own path, and still wish him luck and happiness along the path he chose. I worry.
You are free to believe marriage is defined by gender discrimination. I believe marriage is defined by the union of two people, not that it’s defined by what genders, or races, or faiths, the people in the marriage must be.
Exodus, and Matt, are honest people who have decided to move away from promises to change sexual orientation, away from promises that sexual orientation change is possible, and I respect that as there is no scientific evidence of any change being possible. I would still welcome scientific evidence, so I still am leaving the door open to anyone who wants to provide scientific evidence that change is possible… If all people have is claims of “I know someone,” and nothing scientific or verifiable, I’m going with Exodus here.
@Alex re: our dear friend IluvYHWH
He’s tightly wound that one. If you don’t agree with him then the knives come out. You’re much kinder and have more patience. I tired of things that are tedious and eventually I speak my mind. That’s when they get upset. They liked it better when we cowered in the corner, afraid to even whisper about “the love that dare not speak its name.” Now that we’re no longer afraid, we’re deemed “homosexual activists” with a “far-left AGENDA.” That one makes me laugh. Who doesn’t have an agenda? The christianists certainly do. It’s to keep things just the way they like them to be.
I’m not a man, I’m not a republican, I’m not even american. who’s judging may I ask. If you ee thruth speaking as knives. Good. I hope it penetrates.
and yes, I know I just had several typos. So no need to make remarks about that. spare me the nonsense..
@IluvYHWH
There’s much more to criticize you for than typos but my wi-fi on the beach is cutting out so…
Alex, I see through your conceit every time. Don’t portray yourself as a victim of personal attacks. Another lie. I have defended what the Bible says and pointed out your denial that people have and can (I’m not speaking about you because I don’t know you) change. That is a fact, and your insistence of denying that is because it wrecks your agenda. Neither is the marriage question about equality, but a defintion of what marriage is. You draw a line that it is between two people but you want it changed from being between one man and one woman, the Biblical model, to include same sex. Don’t involve the word discrimination, you want a re-definition. And since civil unions would give benefits it’s merely about forcing your view vs other views on this. It’s not exactly like anyone gay is waiting til marriage to have sex either. So it’s about hijacking the title “marriage”.which is also curious in the secular world since so many hate the Bible with a vengeance. And trying to say the ancient Israelites, and Jesus was ok with that is a lie from hell. Romans and Greeks accepted and even praised same sex practices NOT the Hebrews. I have repeatedly asked you to be honest, that is ALL. Not to agree, it is ok to disagree, but your way of arguing is the root problem of why noone can get along. You are not honest. And that’s on you.
Alex and ostracario are hardcore homos, Alex pretends to be something he’s really not (reasonable) to try to get you to agree with him and ostracario thinks by living in sin his whole life with one person that it is somehow admirable and makes the homosexual lifestyle legit.
Well they are free to go to hell anyway they want but they are not free to try to confuse the Word of God about it. They being apart from God, you can tell they don’t understand the ways of God. They need to get over it, Matt is not one of them, never was, and never will be.
Homosexuality is a curse on this earth, it is an irrational, immoral, sick, perverted, ungodly, twisted way of living and people like Alex and ostracario ARE the problem trying to confuse people including those trapped in homosexuality that it is normal and healthy when that is not the case. And how can any homosexual be honest when their lifestyle itself is a lie?
So no, we will never be silent about the truth of this because living the truth of the Word is what we are instructed to do. Matt understands this, you do, I do, they don’t. “The Light shines amongst the darkness and the darkness comprehendeth it not”.
I don’t know how you would measure if someone is hardcore vs. softcore in their sexual orientation, or who you are to think you know if I am reasonable or not. I rather think you are just being arrogant, writing what you cannot possibly know.
We are all free to go to hell, or all free to go to heaven. Everyone interprets the Bible differently, which is why there are so many denominations and beliefs – and they are all free to their belief. I, as one with God, have had his help to guide me in my understanding. And I know Matt is seeking the same.
Homosexuality is no more a curse than heterosexuality. You are right that emotions and love are irrational – they aren’t supposed to be rational. Heterosexuality and homosexuality are morally neutral, it’s what you do with your relationships or lack thereof that can be moral or immoral. And homosexuals are not sick, they are quite well. Homosexuality is only perverted in that it is different from the norm, like interracial relationships. Homosexuality and heterosexuality can be ungodly, or they can be godly. And my way of living is not twisted.
I am not trying to confuse you – if you are confused that is on yourself. Homosexuals and heterosexuals are not “trapped” by their sexual orientation. Psychiatrists agree that sexual orientation is a natural occurrence, and homosexuality is rare but not at all wrong
And no, neither homosexuals and heterosexuals lifestyles are a lie. My life is my life, no need to lie about it.
You won’t ever be silent, nor will we. Matt understands this, you understand this, and we DO understand it’s your belief too. I know you think we can’t, because you are confused, but nonetheless, the facts remain.
@Alex
You tell ‘em Alex. You’re damn right – I’ll never be silent. Although I am tired of trying to have adult conversations with baby trolls from the Westboro Baptist Church. Like I said, you’ve got far more patience than I for these anti-intellectual troglodytes. Have fun!
You are free to be wrong all you want just as I am free to keep telling you about it.
You’re free to your beliefs, and interpretation of what the Bible says, and I am free to mine. Please respect that, if you can.
I still side with Exodus and Matt here, that there is no reason to believe people can have their sexual orientation changed. I still await any evidence anyone has to the contrary.
You’re free to think gender discrimination is inherent in the definition of marriage, that gender is inherent in the definition, and others are free to disagree.
Civil unions would be a viable alternative to all unions for everyone straight and gay, but unfortunately I see no one fighting to rename civil marriages as civil unions, and I continue to see people fight even against civil unions for same sex couples, and against equality for civil unions in things such as the federal DOMA. When a couple marries, they don’t hijack anyone else’s marriage.
I understand that you will continue to lie about me and say I am dishonest, while nowhere pointing out how I have been. That is on you.
No. You don’t get to end the story.
I didn’t say that they weren’t gay to start with. I reject the notion that gay people can change their orientation from gay to straight. They can sublimate their true nature and claim that they’re managed to become straight, but that’s not possible. You have a few friends who say they’ve “changed” (and I believe you believe that you’ve “changed” as well – why else would be so fired about this?), but I’ve worked with many hundreds of men who’ve been through “ex-gay” therapy and NONE HAVE CHANGED. Hundreds and hundreds of examples. None managed to go from gay to straight. A few of them were so beaten down by the “ex-gay” industry that they committed suicide. I see this in Matt. He’s so messed up by what he’s being told that he can no longer function. He said today that he sold his computer and had someone put a lock on his phone so he can’t download any more apps that will “tempt” him. That’s not a solution. He admitted that. You can get rid of your computer and lock your phone but your brain will always remain. It’s not “satan” that’s in control of Matt, it’s his rationale. The sane part of his brain that knows who he is and whom he’s attracted to.
End of story. I’m wasted all the time I care to on you. Have a great “ex-gay” life my friend. Best of luck to you.
I’m not ex-gay. sorry. and Matt was reaching out to random men on the internet, that is unhealthy no matter what and who you are. Connect the dots. And don’t try and tear down his faith..
I believe that everyone’s sexuality is meant to be straight but something goes wrong in the development process that causes one’s sexuality to become dysfunctional, so I look at homosexuals as really straights who have a sexual affliction called homosexuality, once you find the root of the affliction, then you can cure it and return to a fully healthy functioning heterosexual condition.
But these days, it’s more politically incorrect to embrace the affliction as normal rather than try to correct it, that’s because as a nation we have strayed from God and have become a sick upside down society. There are many ex-Gays who are now married and have kids, are they still gay? Who determines if they have overcome their homosexual affliction or not? And how do you determine it? Are they fooling themselves? If you don’t want to believe healing is possible then there’s no evidence you will ever accept as legitimate.
You’re free to that belief. There is a lot about gender that we know isn’t entirely black and white, male or female, so I understand that it is definitely possible, and most likely probable, that people are meant to be diverse, and we should accept that.
Gay people for me I don’t see as straight, since they do not have an attraction to the opposite sex. Instead, they have an attraction to the same sex. The do co-exist in bisexuals, and if everyone were bisexual, I could see it as the case that bisexuals were meant to be straight.
But in fact, I think it’s something in the development process that causes us all to become who we are, that some become straight, some become gay, and some become bisexual. And that’s not the only thing that happens and gets formed during development – our character, our traits, our masculinity and femininity too seem formed there. I don’t consider development an affliction, and I don’t consider people who are different than others unhealthy or unfunctioning, as there is no reason to.
It is not only politically correct, but actually correct, to not assume something is wrong with someone because you don’t like who they are. It is not accurate to state something is an affliction because you don’t agree with it, especially when there is no way to correct it – as we have found with sexual orientation.
As far as people who claim to be ex-gay, I understand most admit they do have same sex attraction still, and therefore I believe they have decided to go back in the closet, and live life as if they were heterosexual. And so they find a partner they think they should and have kids. They are perfectly free to choose that life, although I wouldn’t want my child to be them or the spouse of them.
We could determine if they have overcome their orientation and replaced it with a different orientation through brain scans, arousal studies, etc – most researchers can test arousal and orientation by eye pupil dilation. I would be very interested in seeing these studies on ex-gays!
It may be they are fooling themselves, or it may be that they are honest and have not changed, but live as if they were heterosexual anyway – like the president of Exodus. He admits he has not changed, though does not life as if he were heterosexual.
If you want to believe healing is possible, then hopefully you’d be able to find some objective evidence that it is! So far, there is none.
There you go LYING again. I know ppl PERSONALLY, and like I said before, everyone who is ex-gay is according to you either in the closet or was never gay, so you have safeguarded yourself entirely and REFUSE to accept anything.anyone says because it pokes hole in your agenda. You talk as if you know everyone on the planet?? have you gone to all ministries everywhere and personally talked to everyone? All you do is sit by the computor and claims it can’t happen. That’s a LIE.
You have had ample opportunity to show some evidence to prove that I am lying, IluvYHWH. In lieu of that, I am going to go with Exodus, and Matt himself, and understand that people do deny who they are. And no, I never said nor talked as if I knew everyone.
When you want to provide evidence, feel free. I still would like to see it, as I have asked before.
I have given you examples of evidence, and you deny it. and if you haven’t met everyone or raither anyone who has changed, which I have, then you shouldn;t go around preaching it’s impossible to change.
Exodus? What a joke. They don’t even believe their lies any more.
John Smid, former director of the “ex-gay” conservative ministry Love In Action, talked last year about his role in the so-called “reparative therapy” that they practiced in this organization. John Smid said not only that he is gay, but that it is impossible to change one’s sexual orientation. He admitted that, in all the years he was involved with the group, he’d never seen anyone – NO ONE PERSON – who’s successfully changed his/her orientation.
“We wanted to teach the wrongs of homosexuality — why it was a sin, why it was wrong, how it could harm their lives — not realizing that stuff was going on in their hearts that we wouldn’t allow them to share,” Smid recalled.
“Now, as I look back, there really is no change in orientation,” Smid added. “And yet at the time, we really believed we were somehow going to rescue these kids from a life of homosexuality…so we set them up, really, for a facade, we set them up for a false image of what life would be like.”
Smid now runs Grace Rivers, a monthly Christian fellowship group for “those who call themselves gay and want to seek a relationship with God in a place where they’re free to do that.”
There’s a clip of the documentary: This Is What Love In Action Look Like that can be found here:
The “ex-gay” people don’t even believe this lie any more!!
I think with Exodus because it grew so fast there was a lot of the blind leading the blind and human will trying to change a very ingrained behavior. This is how it appears to this outsider. I don’t believe there was any sinister intent on their part.
As well you cannot discount the testimonies of those who are delivered from the bondage of homosexuality because they do exist. And you cannot discount the worthy walk a Christian has towards Jesus even if they do struggle or fall.
We need to be tenderhearted towards everyone and allow them to find God’s grace without interference. Pursue God and stick with it and you will find Him. Accept who you are at this point in life but allow God to transform you. God Bless
I understand that Exodus has the best intentions, but intentions don’t make reality. At a certain point, though, I would expect them to acknowledge that false promises are that. It makes me very glad that relatively recently, the president of Exodus stepped forward to pretty much agree with ex-gay critics, that 99.9% of people he knows that have gone through Exodus have not experienced a change in sexual orientation, but are only learning how to cope and repress that.
Unfortunately, many still need to cling to the idea that homosexuality can be “cured,” and I do think when they ignore reality it does turn their intentions cold and sinister. It is more about agenda then helping people at this point.
I do agree that there are many delivered from the bondage of homosexuality, as well as the bondage of heterosexuality. These sex addicts, as I would call them more accurately, can have lasting and healthy relationships with people and with Christ, and I hope that they all do, no matter their sexual orientation.
No homosexuality and heterosexuality are not equal, God made Adam and Eve, not Adam and Steve, so you can either live the way God intended or you can live according to your own selfish twisted desires, many people prefer the latter, all too many, the Bible proclaims “broad is the way to destruction and most people will go that way”
Homosexuality and heterosexuality are different, of course, like black and white are different, but they are to be treated equally under the law. You are of course free to believe differently.
God created us all; He created Adam, Eve, Steve, Eva. He created male, female, and intersexed.
I plan on living the way God intended me to live, not how God intends other people to live, and not how others intend me to live. I don’t plan on going after any selfish or twisted desires, but going after Christ’s love and finding a relationship where I find Christ’s love present.
@steve j re: “No homosexuality and heterosexuality are not equal, God made Adam and Eve, not Adam and Steve…”
You’re still clinging to that? Even my grandmother laughed out loud the first time she heard that one. I’m an atheist so your demented and twisted perversion of scripture means nothing to me. It’s “christians” like you that give the rest of them a bad name. When my husband and I got married in 2005, as soon as marriage equality was made law of the land in Canada, many of my christian relatives came to our wedding. They came to support us and show us that they loved and cared about us. In spite of the fact that we’re a same-sex couple they came. I appreciated that. You probably wouldn’t have come but, judging from some of your comments, you wouldn’t have been invited.
Me too Alex
I won’t pretend to have all the answers about why and how people are or become homosexual. But I do know what God’s word says about homosexuality and I chose to obey Him. If that comes at a cost to me then so be it.
Jesus died and suffered the cross for me, to pay for my sins, so I would say, He is worth every bit of devotion I have.
And if I don’t have enough devotion then I will ask God for some more
If I don’t have enough faith I will ask God to give me the faith I need.
if I need knowledge or wisdom I will go to God and not trust in the wisdom of men.
God Bless
I do know what God’s word says about homosexuality, and more importantly what it means, and I choose to obey Him, too. And that is what brought me to the life I have today. I understand that many different people have many different beliefs, and I am ready for Him to judge whether I understood Him or not.
I know from my personal relationship with God that he wouldn’t want me lying or peddling false hopes like Exodus does, so all I can be is honest and share my story, and hope that people gay and straight find peace with God.
@ Alex
I hope no one is lying here, I assume people are misreading the Bible based on thier personal bias. I suppose God’s grace is sufficient for the blind but not for the intentional liar.
And it hasn’t accured to me you are lying. I am trying to understand you and what you percieve.
I hope no one is lying here either! I do believe many times people misreading the Bible, and often based on their personal bias. For instance, I have seen many people (not specifically here) whose comments reveal in their tone they have an anti-gay bias, and it definitely can come through in how they interpret and misread the Bible!
I don’t think these same people hold an anti-intersexed bias, and often I can see that they don’t use the Bible in the same way when addressing them!
“anti-day bias? “bias”?? If you said you didn’t agree with the Bible’s stance on homosexuality that would be a respectable answer. Your choice, and your belief. To claim it does not speak against it, both OT and NT and Jesus as well, is to LIE. That, my dear, you will get NO respect for.
Fair enough Alex
maybe we just need to pray more for each other and everyone.
I don’t want to cause you any upset by continuning to debate it and I appreciate you talking to me. I am working towards making sure I am not promoting anti-gay rhetoric. It is a process for all of us.
may the God of grace bless you
I wish you well
You don’t want to/can, whatever, change, you stick to what you do, YOU answer to God for YOU, but you need to leave other people alone who want to change and CAN change. You’re not tolerant, you’re not loving and you’re certainly not living Christlike.
I told Matt that he should follow his path as he sees it to Christ. That’s plainly visible in my post to him. If that makes me intolerant, unloving, or unChristlike, then so be it.
Man, this guy is a deluded little coward.
Turbo60640 re: Man, this guy is a deluded little coward.
He said today in an interview that he sold him computer and had someone put a block on his phone so he can’t access Grindr or other such apps. Seriously! They might be able to keep you from tempting things Matty but they can’t stop your thoughts. Oh wait, there’s always electro-shock “therapy.” This boy needs to get away from the cultists he’s surrounded himself with.
Pretty sure the Grindr motto is: Do unto others as you would have them do unto you. It’s holy, really.
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What a waste of a good looking guy!
In Matthew 19:12, Jesus refers to “eunuchs who have been so from birth.” This terminology (“born eunuchs”) was used in the ancient world to refer to homosexual men. Jesus indicates that being a “born eunuch” is a gift from God.
Is Jesus asking you to fight the path he has given you? No. He would expect you to do no harm and enjoy everything before he calls for you.
@an re: Matthew 19:12
Great comment!
Question: “What is a eunuch in the Bible? What does the Bible say about eunuchs?”
Answer: The eunuchs of the Bible were castrated males or those born incapable of reproduction due to a birth defect. The purpose of intentional castration was to induce impotence and remove sexuality. It was a common practice in ancient times for rulers to castrate some of their servants and/or advisers in order to subdue and pacify them. It was especially common to castrate those who tended the royal harem.
In Matthew 19:12, Jesus mentions eunuchs. He says, “There are eunuchs who were born that way from their mother’s womb; and there are eunuchs who were made eunuchs by men; and there are also eunuchs who made themselves eunuchs for the sake of the kingdom of heaven. He who is able to accept this, let him accept it.” This discussion of eunuchs was in the context of the question asked of Him about whether it is good to marry.
Because Jesus says that some eunuchs are “born that way from their mother’s womb,” some gay Christian groups argue that He was referring to homosexuals. Others disagree, arguing that the Bible’s use of the word “eunuch” refers only to those incapable of sexual intercourse through castration or birth defect, those who choose a life of celibacy and those who perform the work typical of eunuchs though they remain perfectly capable of having sex (and thus receive the title by association). The Bible never uses the words “homosexual” and “eunuch” interchangeably. Furthermore, eunuchs are never referred to in Scripture as being in sin, while homosexuality is universally defined as sin in both the Old and New Testaments.
@ an
You have to read the passage from the start. The whole discussion with the Pharisees reads from Mathew19:3-12
Jesus clearly says in that conversation with the Pharisees ” Have you not read that He who made them at the beginning made them male and female and said for this reason a man shall leave his father and mother and be joinded to his wife and the two shall become one flesh. Matthew 19:4-5
So Jesus confirms ” for this reason” male and female marry. Otherwise we are to remain celibate.
I disagree, I don’t think otherwise we are supposed to remain celibate, and I don’t think that is said anywhere.
For instance, I don’t agree that intersexed people, who are in between male and female, must remain celibate. I think they can find the person who is right for them, and that God does have someone right for them. For most people it’s simple, but I think God still has plans for people and the same desire for people whom aren’t so simple.
ok so Alex
my question is if God does not permit sex outside marriage and only permits male and female to marry then how does one reconcile this as a professing Christian? Are you a believer?
My answer is that I do not believe God “only” permits male and female to marry. I do believe male and female are an example, and most marriages will be male and female, so God speaks primarily to them – I do also understand that God is not exclusionary in his words, but we are meant to understand how they apply to all of us.
I do not believe God says that intersexed people cannot marry because they are in between male and female. I do not believe as a Christian we need to speak against intersexed people marrying. And that is how I reconcile it, quite easily, thank you for asking! I understand others may believe differently, and they are free to their beliefs!
@ Alex
why did you bring up intersexed people? How does that fit in to what we are talking about?
I brought up intersexed people because you brought up “male” and “female,” and intersexed people are in between. That’s how it fits.
I think it is possible for intersex people to have a healthy view of sexuality and a successful relationship.
Thank you Michael. I do not think Kathy was ignoring my point, rather I think she didn’t quite understand it.
Kathy, thank you for stating you believe that intersexed people, too, can have a healthy view of sexuality and a successful relationship. I don’t want to assume, but since we were talking about marriage and your belief that it is for “man” and “woman,” can I now state that you believe marriage is for intersexed people too? That the people in between can marry? That God does permit intersexed people to marry? I think if you can reconcile that with your faith, as I do, you are on a great track.
Even though the Bible doesn’t mention God saying intersexed people can marry, I believe that is his plan for them, just as it is for same sex couples. While relatively few people are intersexed, and relatively few are gay, I don’t think God meant to exclude these people from marriage by addressing the majority.
I don’t think that Jesus was trying to state who a person should join with and exclude others, rather that we are all children of God who seek a companion, and we should all find the companion who is suitable for us.
Thank you for entering into this discussion!
With all due respect, Kathy, you are ignoring Alex’s point. And you *assume* that every human being is made from one (or two) cookie cutters, but we are not. In Christ there is no “male and female” says Paul in Galatians 3:28 — he is quoting Genesis 1:27 to overturn it and sweep it away as having no bearing on our status in Christ, for we are all One in the new creation. Yes, intersexed people are real, and “in between” and that is OKAY, and they can even get married to either sex. But too many people, like pharisees, lay heavy burdens on others’ backs and don’t lift a finger to help them. To insist on lifelong celibacy for someone without that call and anointing is just wrong.
I feel sorry for you Matt.
It seems you are prepared to forgo happiness in this life with the expectation that